WEEI>On Demand>>Are pitchers of today soft compared to the past

Are pitchers of today soft compared to the past

Oct 10, 2012|

Mikey, Ryder and Rob Bradford are talking about pitchers and whether we will ever see a 300 game winner again. Rob also talks about Alfredo Aceves clubhouse presence towards the end of the season.

You Might Like

Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.

We're back at a planet Mikey show or talk at some baseball with the one and only robbed sugar bear Bradford -- WEEI dot com fame. How's the website going by the way I'm absolutely -- and -- got a million zillion hits it's an award went well so you mean -- believe you see we can see the spike at this hour. Though exits. -- -- straight then maybe we should put some -- nude pictures on the Internet have somebody -- rumors and -- doesn't have people like you -- like -- -- any time you say nude pictures of surfaced you don't even at -- say -- them in -- going to be did you get out and get a freeze frame of Hulk -- -- from his sex -- who would put on the web -- regularly -- we can superimpose your head on basically anybody audits that. And always works. I saw Hulk Hogan on TV last night doing an interview about NRA's. I everybody's got a sex tape of that what's wrong with me I don't have one -- Europe's done that you don't like him that he -- that you know calls. You know it's just like what is this World -- answer. They know what -- quick path to fame if you're and -- is that your religious young woman is to Vegas next -- and try to deal with the consequences. In an ideal plan -- now back in 1970 to sixty had a much better and related -- -- they were eight millimeter film aspect and I think you know. -- but now I you know this whole this whole thing of the go on back to back in eleven years. Lobbyist values I'm not even talk about probably bring you back this aero. Is that one phenomenon that we should be mindful of is that the last couple years since instead of the testing everything else. The hardest thing to get in baseball we can in this in May be more friendly David -- conversation. But the hardest thing in baseball make the argument is a middle of the order hitter power hitter and he used to be a starting top of the rotation pitcher. But if you look at the numbers over the last two years that's changed. There are a lot of this much fewer guys. Who are heading with the kind of power WTO -- -- true then have been the hardest -- area are you the question and I mean if you are if you take the you guys who with a three ERA or better or guys with thirty all home run their better right. If it's is basically change. And so that's why guys like Ortiz is important. And I agree difficult to get it also. That's one of the reasons I think that he has a better chance this year and maybe getting another offer if they don't. Locked -- last year yeah well who else would be it's an area you really -- target only American League teams yeah sure by the still teams. -- I'll come back -- that this take this take. You know Texas for instance. Mean they're losing if Josh failed to go somewhere they're losing a substantial I'm not target opposition. But you lose substantial back out the -- -- one -- gonna fill that in this not a lot of guys who can do what Dave Ortiz can do. So exit the have to be mindful I now I think he's resigning here so I'll think it's going to be an issue but still. I don't think people can just say well you know what if they were -- after a two year deal in the we give it to him this autumn -- Well good luck -- -- what what do you think he's worth over two readers what do you think army I think if you can make his last two and what to -- two years they offer a nine year. And if you came in said. Viewed two years at eleven. You know maybe twelve. The -- might get the job that it's all dependent on one another team is gonna offer and beat it also you have to factor in the rules have changed though. He's going to be taken a pay cut if he -- attend witch's -- it would just be over thirteen million dollars. Now couldn't they've got him for four years and 4044 million eagle 54 and three years ago -- that's the thing is that. He you don't begrudge him too much because as a business decision. What they're banking on their they're playing their cards right they're saying. Hey you know what we think that you're gonna come back here no matter -- and so we're giving -- needs of these one year contracts. And the right community if you go back to he could lead to sign him to a four year but -- -- say a lot of money -- yeah but but that what they're doing -- there are hedging their big red hedging their -- and then they're covering themselves in case he gets turtle on the -- right the other thing is is that. This is it for Dave Ortiz in terms asking for the multi year contracts it is. You get to 383940. Right you you can't ask for that -- and a lot of free agent he said he understands that so I think that's why one of the reasons important tool. And I hope they go because they do need him today as -- right is hard to replace about like that who's really greatly hurt that stupid Achilles thing going around second base was go home run to right. Yeah somebody else summer wasn't it right. Yes it was inundated -- don't think that's a rare -- gives us all remember one of a New Hampshire is where Steve is hello Stephen. That it. Put your mind -- -- At some 70s60s. Are much -- -- about it. Look at the leaking everywhere and they -- gave where one -- -- out of it. Where the seven -- and two children being hypocrites are. Portico they're -- they're. Quiet because it closes got the game change in the coast are under way. Very. -- -- But you know the thing is that the reason you have a bullpen is when your pitcher you're starting pitcher fails that's what the bull -- for. The open is there -- way -- Wendy via the pitchers tire. I can't can't bring the good stuff anymore but you go -- the real the real mathematical thing here is the best pitcher on the team has the best chance again the guys out. Okay so you know if a guy. That the difference big -- now complete -- retirement toughness. Is you'll have a limit now on guys at this Odyssey almost every single pitcher has a limb -- -- how many pitches they can -- a -- I mean not to and the conversation it's never gonna change right. I mean it's this the interchange back right exactly so I mean -- we can talk about it all this way. Yet it's slowly went down we already cited the number 97 before the almost a thousand more to write games in -- right. But he said because of the men I know Chris Nolan Ryan right now -- -- -- Texas he's asking mormons which it doesn't matter I mean this is a thing does it know people say all Nolan Ryan is gonna get these guys to pitch like they did 1974. No he won't. Maybe he'll appeal may be. Slanted toward a little bit further to that the -- step in that direction why -- -- you just like you back toward my wife you know how much that will be it will be minuscule. Compared to what it was 2030 years because the pitchers can't do -- and that's my point. -- it's in its DeWitt is never gonna it's always tougher. The guy's a court order the right candidate idol that was my point as a point I was making. Even -- -- coordinates date back there's nobody would have it 400 talent they're all. There's that the -- will in all. When would you say that. I -- was it 1943. Before I that it won't -- automatic entry booked up especially at all. But that at Morgan scored the game that he would got it -- -- -- -- want to cut the actual. They changed it just caught it harder ball Al Arab or break that they've got they've got -- -- that -- -- OK so so the era where Ted Williams had 400 and he couldn't do it today but -- looking at 73 home runs. In 1990 and 92001. Some rocketed 73. Home runs. Thirteen more than -- growth so what do you what it would -- side of the argument you come down on. I somewhat but. Well they're quite although it probably look at all the way -- but how do we need to go Cabrera brought doing. I believe we expect a repeat your and that there's -- -- -- batic that Jordan wolf. I'm all the way. You look at. Got 300. Which got -- and was -- Will Greg addicts you know you'd use that John Smoltz isn't for him now he's always favored a bit. But grammatical there's been thrown -- doesn't -- hard. If I mean. She's I don't even supporters of any era. That's eleven a lot of the great -- of it. Oh and in Bristol, Rhode Island I don't know I go ahead on. I'm like I don't value tonight. That might just a few it is -- like hood. Games sided and complete beings. This topic really fascinates me. Warrants -- 1942. That I. Game started they on this and I complete gains might 382. Right. But it without Bob alternate landing and what a lot of innings. Yet there -- a bit insert. Our games are 480 war. Obama really practice on your comment and -- 1243. Back -- out well. Games started pouring in for a complete games might 279. Right. -- you know as the numbers go down a -- of trying to blow 69. -- -- some -- only have let me stop here -- system honest I want de -- I would -- going on here. Some of it has to do with the format rotation because we you know these days of 32 starts you're you're doing your job I write it in the old age of forty or 38. Starts aunts and so it's not just a former rotational it's humanity's -- based on how long you stay in the game now -- -- DH came in to meet. The American League anyway that became an excuse to keep of a starting pitcher in longer because in many cases they would pinch hit for the pitcher in a situation where they -- Iran's. Are of the guy got reasonably tired they're up three -- four -- the only right one anyway. But it's so you know and I understand this is different mentality starting with -- -- the real Serra of politics back to you before that Sparky Anderson really. About throwing pitches edited different situation seventh eighth ninth and all that stuff but now it's like it's like that's the book. Well let me just also tell you somebody -- Nobody in this NBA today to do -- set shot like about a hundred guys to do in 1950 -- that shot was better than ever in 1950. But that doesn't mean anything. 8 o'clock today that it ought to put Paris but by comparison is that it's a different game it's a different era and we can throw out all these innings and complete games and everything else. Every right thing has changed I get it so Regina it's justified I value for pitchers and what they deal. If Pedro Martinez pitch in 1940 how do you think you would have done. We have more complete games. Well and I probably not bringing that back. -- that notoriety -- that I know he's not he's not bringing that back everyone wants to think that. Because it does Nolan Ryan talks about extending the innings in stemming the pitch count every. And yes sure is but it's all relative to today's pitcher. It is not gonna ever come back to what you were talking about you Obama all right rob you can really -- though nobody but if if you look at we already cited how it's gone down since even 1980. How how much is gone down so much every single year he keeps going down and down debt so if you want to bring it back to 1999. That far no -- could do that okay. They'll do it for a few years to get the right pitchers there. And that'll change but my point is is it is not gonna go back to -- you're talking about it will never do that. Right I think that's maybe because of the you know the mental state of the people who were directing the traffic when it comes to minors and are bringing these kids up protecting their investments. -- a Molly coddling them -- won't pay feeding them. Yeah well I mean there's a lot of things that we're not gonna go back to that used to be. And you know things change but it's just to say someone's gonna comment and say you know what you gonna pitch like Lawrence bond. You don't pitch like Bob Feller you're gonna -- like. Jim law on board. It's it's it's it's nice to say that it's nice to have I agree like you here's a better analogy is that you look at the Tampa Bay race. Last year when the Red Sox starters couldn't get through four innings right in September right and the rays come in and their pitching 89 priced right I liked it right so. It's not necessarily like the results though those rays pitchers are no I didn't even come close to what you're talking about in the seventies or sixties or whatever. But they were a lot batter and they had a different mindset and that's what you want. You want you want that type of mind that you knock my point is you're never -- yeah I mean I'm unhappy as a as a guide pitched seven solid innings editors -- -- -- In his right amount of money seven in the amount of money that you're paying relief pitchers to do their that job of it's the eighth and ninth inning. Then that's what. You want from start -- pitching amid -- this year how happy would you be if the Red Sox starter or what would be in the playoffs right now threads -- some of their starters in game seven. Solid innings most of the time idea that we can you compare the Red Sox saw as saying seven innings Celtics seven innings these days. Either way India its bottom of the sixth it's Baltimore too with the Yankees won Ichiro is on first base -- another bat. Now parity now I don't know you it. I don't worry -- -- -- RU 375. Bigoted die who was the sweetest tasting Geico -- I had -- -- -- victory Miguel Gonzales incredible food jobs in Brockton. I John -- or what's gone. I got called up the need to talk about. Bob Gibson in you know how we couldn't pitch in today's game the next set their academic so what did you realize. I think Gibson had was 21 in nine in 1967. Would like one point 19 Gary. No one point 12 and 68. It was that would work yet to 48 complete games in one season. Yet and I mean the guy was that you bought into the last nine games like one nothing into what. Yeah oh yeah oh sure -- happen to Colfax constantly too but you know what and it's easy. But it it's Sandy Koufax walked away from baseball you know and at one point seven -- Cy Young award. -- and we understand he -- -- burned out as a border but Bob Gibson. I just as a comparison I mean that they're guys that are probably light cam but don't aren't asked to do. Or global demand to do what he demanded -- he would he had a whole lot of that ball and keep that ball or. They're -- -- -- -- apartments like a seven I want -- to -- their title. That. -- -- -- Advocate for this for anybody say Bob Gibson couldn't pitch in any era is I'm African mind. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Seven and 93 star -- Evans. You're gonna say it's disheartening that you jumped off the Alfredo says I've been lagging well I mean I still think the guy can pitch I just think there's definitely mentally. A that gap there haven't given everybody else. -- everyone Dolan is jumping on Bobby Valentine for -- showing up late that day and rightfully so in some respects. In the last stretch of games Alfredo -- was showing up so late for games. He was showing up he was showing up at like 5 o'clock ruined the new weights is it in relative terms it's just the last game of the year. He -- the team all goes out distracts him heating give you go out. Them at army is it was it was banned well you know Bobby Valentine I wonder much like the paper boarding better opted will be circling. Fenway Park looking first two million dollars not to dollars -- two million hits on his plate. But those -- the press conference with the bike helmet hit. Sure he had they Jimy Williams of the Nebraska after the bye now all Alina I announced he had his personality makes -- knew needed. I -- I expect just wanted to have switched to grab food options on the -- -- -- I didn't hurt that. They're gonna start testing for Ricci eight election is their current. I don't know if it's next year another doing the minor leagues. It's gonna assume whatever it is the government would do this -- it. -- probably goal better than anybody's shooters in the locals the other guys are getting off the stuff. There and anticipation. Well yeah I I have no I. I have no way of knowing who -- appreciation who's not graduate from Bob but I'll I'll say this -- Pete Royce and a little while ago. Which is if you look at since they've cracked down on testing how baseball has changed. It's been dramatic that it's been pitching dominant. Over the last few years and to find those home run hitters even though he's do you still have guys like Curtis Granderson and some other guys. But the find those guys as much more difficult than it was even five years ago Eddie Murray is going on is is pitching dominant well how much tree it is in -- mega deal in numbers I'll try to do some break by -- yeah it's. There's a lot more guys with with lower -- -- -- sub 303. ER -- -- -- war. Say five years ago I'm almost positive it. The reason to question there's no wonder -- but you know looking like the Red Sox. Would -- president deciding David Ortiz. It's been protest vote. Probably I I don't think this president decide David Ortiz but but you raise a good point and and baseball overall. Is that you have to be wary of any guy -- side. You know once something connected if these guys -- yet not the stuff. There had been Iraq could put up the numbers they have in the past. And it. -- but -- Harvick celebratory -- army 245. Homers a year for ten years. I read that that was in the sixties and and Z eight era of the pitcher I don't think -- -- with a very strong -- I don't really small stronger. -- -- No I know what is the fact is that we haven't seen the seventy in the 66 home runs and a numbers like that and and and clearly there are fewer forty home run guys. You know I didn't -- on this one time and it was at the peak era you know happened between 1996. And 2003. That's when people -- were the most Joost. Well that's immediate I seemed to become -- backed terrorists and that's why they think we're seeing more and all the good news. These you know in the world but he still was there simply aren't that good news channel line up a lot of -- you know eighteen to 42 quality to be. Nowadays. It wasn't unusual 78300. Didn't little. Yeah another thing are also seeing relative to what retired over the I think there was a lot less fastballs thrown this year than even -- -- and and that's how booed the trend they go into it. But you know what Torre you know -- many different pitchers and told me this and including some of the people we've talked about tonight as far as you know. Pitching Smart pitching to contact make that your pitch it on to go full counts -- these guys try to strike -- -- Lot of guys have that mentality. A lot of guys are burning through a lot more pitches that are necessary. In order for them to accommodate a complete game because they know they're only gonna 410 pitches so they can work their way -- -- through the seventh. And throw as hard as a candidate did a route that I don't know is -- is any question about different mentality completely different approach. And a lot of that has diluted muted too much confidence -- who's coming after them in the game. Or they're just sadly mistaken about them you know -- the bridges is gonna relieve -- going to be better than they were. You know debate and they are -- payment pecking order of the pitching rotation who's out.

News & Analysis