WEEI>On Demand>>The Patriots trade Logan Mankins 8-26-14

The Patriots trade Logan Mankins 8-26-14

Aug 26, 2014|

Dale, Andy Hart, and Field Yates react to the Logan Mankins trade.

Transcript - will not be 100% accurate

Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good on knock -- idea I mean it's better to be both good and like even if you've. You got a choice sometimes luck is better. Because I'm going to be honest with you last week when we booked our. Our co host for today's program little did we know that Bill Belichick was little -- the 78 mile an hour fastball down the heart of the plate forest. And knocked out of the park field gates ESPN ESPN boston.com is in the house and the heart patriots football weekly is in the house. We get handed this panic this this story. Six time probable guard Logan Mankins trade into the Tampa Bay Buccaneers today. -- tight end Tim Wright will be shocked to hear he played his college ball Rutgers. And according to Adam chapter fields colleague at espn.com. A fourth round pick in next year's draft. That's the hall that you get welcome -- -- what whatever will we talk about today up and dale. You know what I figured out Tommy Kelly that was the surprising move I figured it out. You gotta pay for Jermaine Jones somehow I mean there's a whole lot of money going to Jermaine Jones of New England Revolution you got to free up. Some money here for I mean I got nothing neither this is for me this hearkens back. To that day when they traded Richard Seymour to the Oakland Raiders that's what this felt like to me when and sit in the office and field said patriot just trade Logan Mankins. To Tampa Bay and I went. It what appeals little easier to sell that move though when you're getting. You know a fourth round pick. And that's not really all that exciting. And I know people start to say who's this Tim right guys in a sending talented tight end and certainly fills a need for the patriots had moved tight end. But you know his coach Lovie Smith wasn't all that happy within about a week ago in terms of his production this summer. I don't think it's us an absolute shocking move just because. When you're in new England and you have a veteran player who's not as good as he once was who's making more money than he ever did. The writing is start to -- starting to be on the wall before you that said. It is stunning because they you have more confusion now on the interior offensive line. And be for me personally is my favorite patriots about. -- so. I think the question is where do we start to -- and the patriots motivation to get creative or trade -- Why Logan Mankins is expendable at teams like a reasonable place to start because although Logan Mankins was April blow last year. And news and you can -- jumping on this one I think he may be the most respected veteran. In that locker may be aside from Tom Brady certainly offered to -- ball. 32 years old so he's on the back half of his career but he's not in his late thirties but if you look at the patriots in the roster construction right. You look at the players that project is locks were in your locks for the 53 man roster you've got guys like Dan Connolly. Logan. -- the Logan Mankins who no longer look Americans could said that a little while ago Tim Connolly Ryan when dale. Marcus cannon Josh Kline John a lot you Jordan David at five guys who were sort of compete if that interior line mixed. So the patriots without Logan and we saw last year in a Baltimore game. -- is not able to play out actively there and football they are known to find guys who could replace departed players. So big do you have players on their roster who are not saying at Mankins level it capable NFL vector. What they don't have on their roster right now is a tight -- and capable backup Rob Gronkowski or filled in for Rob Gronkowski. If you were to misspeak wonder this if you can sort of the season because of his current injury. And the question is. Is that what -- -- Is -- as I said as -- and a sending young player who caught. You know I've already seen it on Twitter people are comparing Aaron Hernandez his rookie year with Tim writes rookie year and I think they're comparable at T a TI price -- touchdown catches 571 yards. Five touchdowns last year. -- as a rookie. But as late as what does this story for August 17. Last Sunday. Lovie Smith was basically saying he's just not performing as well as he should be he's not catching the ball he's not blocking and if you're an H back who doesn't. Block then all of a sudden they just treat US an extra receiver and you lose -- mismatch advantages so. You know we're gonna have to wait and see. What Tim Wright is -- will be able to assess that in the coming weeks and months how valuable he's going to be they don't have a tight end that is that is the fact that field said. You have Rob Gronkowski and in terms of catching the pass you have nobody else Michael Bowman now a new week. Is is and was irrelevant -- across a pass to -- he can block and oh by the way he's hurt. He still coming off all a left knee injury still wearing the big Don -- berets not sure what his status will be to start the year and oh by the way we're not even sure Rob Gronkowski. Is going to be on the field to start the year so you there's no question you've added. A competitive NFL tight end how good he can be. Who knows but he's competitive and to probably play if you need to Miami yeah I am curious if the shock factor here is more because of that name. Or because it seems like the patriots are shipping off. Star player because I know one of the prevailing nearest perhaps more low on a national level and a local level is that. Logan Mankins and I'm -- to anchor it is has has has. -- move past his peak his pride last year toward the end of the -- people are saying. There handy in the Pro Bowl nod because there aren't any other good guards or he should deserve he's getting a reputation below. I still think make is one of the top eight guards and football. But I wonder if the shock factories because. We steal big is it more because the player and the reverence people have for him or is it more because of -- level play and perhaps the compensation well return. Let's in fact go over that little bit last year the patriots offensive line to be kind struggled gave up forty sacks the most in Tom Brady's career. Logan Mankins reportedly was responsible for eleven of those. You wouldn't think that would necessarily translating to a Pro Bowl selection but it did he is a six time pro bowler I think it's fair to say. Some of that last year at least was probably based more on reputation in fact I think that's fair to say once you're Pro Bowl you can get into that grist mill and and you keep churning -- the specially on the interior offensive line where nobody looks -- but having said all of that stuff. Isn't he clearly the patriots best offensive -- today while I tell until an hour ago. I think you could debate that I do think he has fallen off a little bit the last couple years and he certainly has had some bad. Please and bad games. At the end of the year in playoff scenarios in bad situations. And I actually think this is an interesting one for patriots fans is that a lot of fans were annoyed with -- Logan Mankins because of those sort of mark key failures you know one play here one play they -- but it happens to come in January. And I think some fans thought he was overpaid at ten million dollars a year. But I also think they're gonna react holy crap they trade Logan Mankins is Jordan -- gonna play left guard now and what is the falloff. We saw an awful lot of so far in the precinct and I think has struggled at times and not just because he stepped on Tom Brady's foot I think he's been pushed around a little bit at times. The one guy that I think is sort of an interesting bit player in this or may be more than a bit player. Is Dave -- -- the new offensive line coach who you know up until a few minutes ago. Was probably assuming okay I have -- older I have Sebastian Vollmer and it Logan Mankins the rest okay maybe that's gonna be pieced together maybe it'll change during the year but that's my foundation. And now you're saying you're taking -- theoretically. His best player and no question his leader in that group the guy who was. Not just a leader in that group a leader on the team a guy who's a captain a guy who as as Mike -- just pointed out was on the stage at the at the premiere last night. With the likes of Tom Brady that that's the hierarchy that's the stratosphere he he -- Mean this is. You know -- face of the franchise -- -- it's always throws subjective argument but certainly play it -- terms of tenure in terms of what he's meant he's patriots hall of Famer he's -- -- when his career ends five years later he'll be in the patriots. You know awesome in that slaughter and Mecca time wrote but depending on how things went when they told him today -- what acted he's a guy that it wouldn't stun -- member in his contract negotiations. Where he was basically the point. I've made enough money I know it's not as much as everything you need in professional sports. I'll just go on my ranch I'm OK with that that's who -- -- I'm a rancher and drive my truck and that's who I am. I'm not saying this would happen but I wouldn't be stunned if he's one of those guys that this hits them like a ton of bricks and he's really. You wanna play anymore because he's a member the first press covers he did this year Tom -- and asked him. How many more of these -- be getting these training camps I don't know I wanna keep doing it for awhile but it's a fair question to ask at this point in his career. This is this is a -- has got to be a shocking blow. For a guy -- only played here for a decade only played for one offensive line coach bracing for a decade and Elvis and you get shipped off to Tampa and you know ruin are we gonna get. We talked about the Richard Seymour trade and -- for me it feels similar. The only other one I can I can equate this to you know near the end of the regular season before the and of the pre season. For the start of the regular season was the cutting of lawyer Malloy and an and I use that not in terms of a one -- -- was cut one guy who was traded. But the leadership you guys talked about lawyer Malloy it was that guy on that team as well. He was one of those voices of the of the locker room as Logan Mankins is he was a guy whose leadership was unquestioned. So. I guess you get an extra week to get that out of your system here. -- the patriots and I would say a major difference in my opinion between those two deals. You had Vince Wilfork who was sort of next in line in terms of leadership. You had Rodney Harrison who -- new had already shown any leadership and was a captain. Within weeks of being here I'm not sure who the next in line guy is on the offensive line you have a couple of -- a couple of tackles who. Don't really care to talk to be leaders to sort of be out in front they like to do their work their play do their talking. You have Dan Connolly and Ryan when Dallas returning starters who a lot of people thought were vying for me 81 roster spot between them that could be out of town. Who who's the voice who's the leader who's the guy in that group are nicer to voice because I don't think the -- was the kind of got -- got your -- and said let's do this or -- it was more. You see what I'm guys look at him and says okay disguised point -- or ACL and he's an offseason award work out I offseason award winner. That's how he showed his leadership of their various forms of leadership there players like Vince Wilfork who is. A vocal leader hale also as a performance leader is a publicly on the field and fair. Wilfork has -- -- I don't think he was always quite as vocal leader he really I think took the next step when he signed that forty million dollar contract to sort of lead his roots here and knew he was going to be here so I don't think in immediate. Terms do you need. The guy who's you know gonna say whatever needs to be said but. I do think there is a major loss of leadership -- a question of leadership within that group. And it's a young group you know fuel went over those names you have Jordan -- practiced water. John a lot PO a rookie you have Bryan stork a rookie Cameron Fleming a rookie these are all -- now potentially for playing time. Aren't following -- happy highway for a minute here OK let's let's let's take it to the next logical step or illogical step as the case may -- On their -- the story -- the last 24 hours has been -- in -- need it was in Tampa talking with the Buccaneers cleared by the NFL. -- apply everybody -- he's all yours if you want. Don't obviously Logan Mankins is not taking that spot. Akron and conspiracy dole now he -- to you know. But based arts -- Egypt is so dire could end up there hasn't mom saying is not a practiced -- Oniel Cousins who last year was perhaps animate separately one of the worst offensive -- Indiana now. They've recently trader for Rashad Johnson from the chiefs. Who begin this summer is -- projected starter for them and I mean mass of office of my travels he filled out adapter I would be shocked. If they at a -- I need to act. -- in -- needle in Logan Mankins to. Both have toughness but also have a very different demeanor to them. And think about it from the box perspective if you're gonna add in -- need to -- when his reputation and his locker room antics. Who better to add the Logan Mankins because he's got taken in crap from anybody in if he doesn't like minority in Carolina we so he. On -- on a leadership cents a prime makes great sense to bring Logan Mankins in and make sure he keeps Richie and got -- -- -- -- -- Go ahead quickly -- this from a respected personnel mine too -- Part communicate within reach out to me and asked what was the pick it as a 154 rounder. He says banks. Belichick wins again. Really the Mankins is declining not the same guy the B 333. Years six and a half million dollars -- season has -- Now that's just one person's take what I would say that you know. The patriots as we talked about time and time again do you a long range lands out. Mortgaging all of their short term capabilities perhaps they -- Logan Mankins is is he worth the exact. Price that they're paying him at this season. The the salary cap number for Logan Mankins this year was ten point 5000002 highest second only to Tom Brady on the team. Miguel salary cap page which. I uses my Bible and these things because I think they're really gonna what they don't be surprised how many other people -- do -- -- -- they tweet about a little while ago. It is likely that Mankins earned his offseason workout bonus money. Very likely. Are making his 2014. Dead money yet four point 25 million is 2015. Dead money yet formally. Bring it up because. The other story line the other narrative I've -- the last hour is all they're freeing up money. They're gonna get Darrelle Revis signed to a contract they're gonna get Sebastian Vollmer signed a contract wherever it is. The -- freed up enough money to get either of those kinds of deals done here. Well. -- tell -- the savings are. The safe five point 75055. Million dollar terms of cash this year six point 415 terms of cash next year beat cap savings right now. For 20145. Point 755. Million dollars. Next year we'll count four million against the cap. So the pictures it's certainly true of the trunk space. Whether it's enough to sign a draw Revis what they'd be interested in doing that before resumed at regular season game right. Well we've got a story a couple of weeks ago that that Robert Kraft it's supposedly. Reached out to Revis -- training camp and hey you know we'd be interested -- getting a deal done. Maybe there was more of that them and I realized that the time maybe that is something that the working I don't know. Yeah the first thing I thought I was may -- -- sold -- maybe they're looking to a long term deal and they sold or he's gonna count on the cap I believe it's acceptable righteous at -- seven point five I think is the F fifty year option for next year. May -- they're looking to do an extension with him. And sort of -- that money out and make him sort of the cornerstone of the next whatever it is five or six years on the offensive line. And you know we've talked about it before guards in this team a lot of money wrapped up in a guard and our nose tackle. Because of contract in nearly a hundred million dollars between those two positions which. May or may not be money well invested in this modern day of football where everything's played on the edges and speed and passing game. It might be a little more palatable to now do a deal was sold or make him your franchise left tackle and your money's wrapped up in sort of the mark key positions in the way the game is played today so. They're always looking to do deals they're always looking to extend -- -- he is also in the mix for an extension and that's gonna cost you some money so. This just this plays in that long term scenario then you remove Hernandez from the books next year that's seven and a half that he's on the cap this year. It's that long term. Churning the roster churning the money and keeping it moving forward and keeping it well spent with the used in the positions that matter we we know that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have a gaping hole of the guard position. We know they brought and -- and content Ito yesterday. To perhaps address that. I'll be fascinated to find out and feel I know you guys will be on top of this who initiated peace talks. Who got a hold of who first well did Bill Belichick reach out to to Lovie Smith that Lovie Smith reach out to Bill Belichick how to work. Well what more need to keep in mind Jason light. The bay Buccaneers general manager to be here used to be here knowing there's always open dialogue with your former cohorts who now run or part of a different organization -- The books have made history I think it even visiting with Richie and -- neo is basically a huge sign. -- plastered across your your stadium billboards. We are looking for guard help. And what the patriots at any intentions of treating Logan Mankins Pryor might make it prior to today or yesterday is unclear but. I get the feeling is this kind of move you make if you thought about efforts eighteen or so hours perhaps at the back of their mind listen. If the right deal came across or if we could create the deal perhaps would be opened for business. And lacked flair and like Logan Mankins was standing on that stage last night. And these things come together quickly not -- -- -- -- -- that Bill Belichick was like twenty minutes late to his press conference today it's funny how a lot of times when that happens or he comes out on the practice field. And is sort of talking on the phone last time I saw that he was a little late to practice talking on the phone they traded for Ben best and -- worthy. Today he shows up to his press conference slate they -- Logan Mankins sometimes those pieces come together. Out real quickly one now layer to this. Tim writes coach when he caught fifty passes last year was -- Greg Shia who also recruited him directors. And who also spent the Columbine -- Bill Belichick has been on the practice field for a few days hang out Bill Belichick so the scouting report on. Tim Wright is very much I got beyond qualities as a patriots fan that's that's when speaking as here's the patriots and I'm sort of sick of -- guys in patriots uniforms. It's like enough is enough. We're not talking about bringing in you know eighteen guys from Alabama. Are you know eighteen guys from Ohio State or something I mean how many records guys the actually need on an NFL roster because apparently we -- at the number no. And worked out that some him -- product much according to -- for all we notre on -- going to be starting safety Logan -- could be -- nickel corner. Tim Wright to be your starting moved tight end. -- And we haven't that the number again how negative that powerhouse down in Jersey all know how well players. It assistant coaches and tell our guys and we're on day here. Well I'll be curious to see what they do with the money that they've saved and that's what fans are gonna wanna say you're the best you you are radio legend here it's not just the deal -- now we spent -- Which spend the money so you trade irreparable guard which has -- the money you saved downfield just -- the numbers and what fans are gonna say as. -- -- In a you're paying for another story patriot place you know how they how this thing gets portrayed in these parts. All this is Bob Kraft putting more money in his back pocket not spending it on the football team when you kind of fuel that with your little on Jermaine Jones and -- -- comment right. It's a very big star and what's really sad for the -- England revolution. They scheduled the introduction for Jermaine Jones to the media 2 o'clock today. At all. Took -- and who. It's Camille Little tough for -- get a whole lot of publicity for the for the revolution to make he practiced with -- in this morning. And the they're gonna have their big they're big hey here's Jermaine Jones newest member of the revolution at 2 o'clock today. Oops maybe they'll get packaged together in all the sports casts and and neck in all these you know comings and goings at Gillette Stadium Mankins out Jones -- you know. Maybe they can ride the coattails of this being Mankins move but my guess is haven't opened the lines get them to do right now my guess is. Patriot nation hates this deal. -- because I could see their reaction to pay because of the -- the old theory Tom Brady's getting older he doesn't move. We're Super Bowl contender but every time we comes to a screeching halt that because Tom Brady gets pressured up the middle. And we just traded the ten million dollar Pro Bowl guard. And CNB in my opinion the best offensive lineman yeah. The problem -- that whole argument is sometimes when they've been pressured up the middle in the past the guy's been blowing -- by Logan Mankins. Ten million dollar probable -- Will get a chance to see which you think right now at 6177797937. A you can text this if you'd like boy have you guys found that already at 37937. We're trying to figure -- -- we get the perfect people to do that feel gates from ESP NS in the house. -- heart patriots football weekly it's dale -- Sports Radio WEEI. I've been very fortunate. Those catastrophic injuries have been looking -- to steal twenty in this entire time and played very very good food trade organization and a lot of great teammates. And it's it's been it's been a fun read and hopefully less a few more years I don't know I just I think I've been truly. That's Logan -- not today. I was actually couple months ago. It was. Probably. During what do routier's or something yeah April yeah it was it was this and there was another cut in there -- -- we haven't but he said something -- effective. You know be around as long as they still want me -- -- the answer to that today if they don't want to around anymore if you follow the patriots comments program and I do. Five hours ago they posted a photo Logan Mankins. -- -- view -- mangan Mankins from the back of his Jersey in the seventy in the name. It got one in 1168. Likes so far I'm guessing one of them isn't Logan's no probably not. They have they have posted a photo sense then of Tom Brady. A twelve days in -- tell them that the opener. But five hours ago was Logan Mankins now again in the defense of whoever's running the hamster Graham account for the New England Patriots. I'm guessing that Bill Belichick doesn't call that person to take a just tipped you off. Idly that Mankins up Ian Graham account today from you know all the way out only does not that it had now maybe -- By the -- to deal. Logan Mankins is is a testament to his toughness and united haven't suffered a catastrophic. In my career a you know I don't. Is to me that's extremely serious injured -- that shows just how tough. And rugged Logan Mankins is a separate and apart. From whether the patriots can replace him during the run production their pass protection all that stuff they're gonna miss. That's a that's a factor edited in any team to get through department Logan Mankins is going to miss. That two top with the attitude and nasty and this is a team that struggles -- that times are they just a Tom Brady led. Spread passing attack that isn't tough and he's always been the guy that. We want her on the ball we think we can run the ball if they give us more chances and then when they succeed see we told you we could run the ball he gave us the chances. -- -- was that now you know who for -- do you do you go the other -- -- Tuesday you know people are talking about your guy in my Greece leaving Steven -- off the roster. You know the the ability to run the football is generally sort of equated to being a tough football team and being in November December football team. Well the running back could be on the way out the best guards on the way out -- like you're now trending more towards just a sort of soft. Passing attack offense again. -- before we get the calls let me just -- the last narrative that you hear a lot in this town -- -- don't forget. Logan Mankins was in a very public salary dispute with that with the patriots and things were said back and forth the relationship was damaged. And this is the Kraft family's way of getting back at Logan Mankins course you could also say the exact same thing about Vince Wilfork. That he's been traded anywhere yet no but you'd have the same narrative for him as well. I don't happen to believe that particular narrative -- you know you're gonna hear in this town nor do lie and if you need any better example if you watch the Ty Law induction ceremony into the hall patriot place in the relationship that. He has with Robert Kraft and Ty Law had a very ugly contract dispute now that was a little bit more targeted Bill Belichick but it's still the patriots organization. In the year there's a certain aspect of business involved here and I tend to think that the crafts are very good businessman who can be tough businessman when they need to be. But also can put that aside when they need to so -- I don't really buy this is some you know. Effort to it to pay maintenance back for anything he did or said a settlement community. Belichick and and you know it's it's it's it's going to be sure that people will approve this but at the end of the game the patriots perspective. Analysts say it's transparent commitments that I think if you take logic step back and think about the here three years six point 25 billion dollars. Left on the deal for Logan Mankins. Over the next three seasons six point 25 year run at the agents. He's will be 33 this is -- -- so -- 35 year old guard six point 25 million guard is unlike other positions that caught up. In terms of rising -- you're still getting top level talent. -- -- You know less significant. Figures a year. You help yourself financially you create space for potential other extensions which. Missed about a earlier perhaps -- real brief -- they wanna consider either after this season or during and other players of course. Its leaders and young talent on the -- needs to -- him McCarty and the like that's part. There's also the fact that you know it's replace ability help replace it is this player patriots right now they -- the three offensive line. It got a player in tour and Debbie who has been amongst the more surprising players has -- deeply honest it was surprising he played. But what it now honestly there are now. -- -- now where they laying the foundation and now make sure he's ready Hollywood going to eat where they planning this all through the the course of pre season you don't trade Logan you don't wake up on a Tuesday and salmon argument I don't like. Number seven trade him to -- but I wouldn't put money -- strippers and I got out while someone makes a report with. Yet matured daddy's a bomb he's never played -- -- game that maybe European but the patriots estimation is the one that we're trying to figure out -- -- And if they're estimation this guy can be started -- guard -- swing guard behind. Josh Klein are being Connolly Ryan went down solar market skated again that was telling it after basically being -- back -- the first two pre season games ovals and Ryan went gals back worked with the starters term pursuit game three game matters most. So you could hypothetically. Line up right when dale. Dan Connolly and other Josh in a market skin and your guard spot. And those before players for three spots. And I think all people understand at least I think it's reasonable to say are all starting level and it felt when they'll struggle last year. Our client really only played one full game but those are players that. If if you put teams they would be starters so the patriots may say listen these are starting level talents. Two years ago everybody was it right when -- won't be sending sectors in the NFL perhaps somewhere in between where it was two years ago in where he was last year. But nonetheless even after the -- trade. The patriots at least more players who should be thought of its starting level prospect for the cure their -- Art this is unfair but we airing the Turks society some going to be unfair and I ask you quickly here as we go to the calls. -- -- A dealer bad start -- Good deal. I've been a little down on the Mankins contract and situation for a couple years not just for the value of the player I love him more than anybody I think he was a great leader off the field. On the field I'm not sure he was a ten million dollar contributor ten million dollar player so you were able to get a draft pick in May be a guy at a position of need. That can help you in September of this season's -- the good deal I wanna play -- both sides of the fence here a couple I wanna do but I'll -- good deal as well because. As an -- the savings. Extra draft capital which was that people say only four for -- I went out here on time only fourth -- and then people accurately I'm -- on this and so I got up. I think Tim writes an -- he played lights -- I'll be curious to see how we change the narrative of the patriots tight end depth. I know -- his stats or blow you away good last year but it's different when your plane with Tom Brady and when you're playing with Mike Lamb and Josh -- and they are blow you away good if you compare them to every tight end in New England in the last year plus not -- -- Absent when they would get one attempt and no catches out of a tight imposition basically was an average game so I. I like the trade and the other thing is. Is this in Vegas we have to know go to Bulldog -- -- if they have new logs for the patriots mean as this earth shattering yes he's your captain -- a leader and yet shattering -- For this team yes. On one level does it change anything the way you feel dale about this team's championships yes it is really which is why I don't like to steal. -- don't write a Super Bowl because they don't have low -- I might do just traded your best offensive lineman. And I will grant you that he has slipped a bit over the last couple of years and that may be. At least last year maybe the last two Pro Bowl berths were were on reputation more than an actuality I'll give you that. He still your best offensive -- in my opinion. I have played an entire season with a torn up -- for God's -- nobody tougher. I'm not sure that Tim -- floats my boat here and I know we have the 54 catches last year in the 571. Yards in the five touchdowns. So coach was calling about a week ago saying he's -- too many balls. You know -- -- period NH back drops to many balls you just become another receiver they don't account for you out there. Lobby slipped them picky was that good for Tampa Bay well. They weren't throwing him the ball in Tampa Bay for God's sakes do you think there may last year and don't you think there may have been now there's a coaching change and that's part of the issue but don't you think they may have been some -- -- coaches do that they're trying to motivate a talented young player. -- always sure that happens all my -- doesn't happen here so much but I don't have a monopoly but it does happen in places and you can't argue the need. You cannot argue that the patriots. Needed to add a tight end now I think a lot of us assume maybe they would signing guys after final cut to they would at a -- some way. Or at a guy via a trade for just you know fifth round pick -- and -- and so you're screwed up not getting uptight and depth leading up till now. So you trade away your best offensive -- try to make up for what that's what it feels like to me but don't don't. Look like the patriots got that taken here and that they didn't wanna trade Logan Mankins and obviously they clearly wanted to trade him and they clearly weren't comfortable that what you expected that the same -- the Bill Belichick always get back to value. He had value. As a ten million dollar left guard and I don't think he did I think it is comes down to what the patriots the appreciably better or worse on the yield. In the run game in the past game with Logan Mankins -- replacement level player. -- it -- I'm not sure that'll be. Will be -- -- -- different but what I will say in my estimation I would look at street more of we trade toughness. Veteran leadership a player that is perspective in the locker room for cap space. Draft picks -- draft pick. And players that fills -- need Robert and I think that's where I'm going to ultimately find myself valuing the deal. Down in the -- I don't parking lot toughness and leadership that that's in argue. I don't like the trade right now where I'll be proven wrong if I'm proven wrong is show me what they do with the money. Okay they got Neitzel assigned to a new deal they got -- according signed to a new deal -- I don't really get excited they got to -- Revis signed to a -- fine. And if Tim right. Is a better receiver than I am giving him credit for. If it you know it -- improves on what he did last year he certainly got a better quarterbacks on the football that is in arguable. He should be better just that. Can you bring a tight end who won at least like some of these other receivers the patriots brought it. Just don't quite get on the same page with Tom Brady. Fair question -- does it happen here as a lot and he's arriving you know the week of the fourth and final pre season game. And and we're gonna expected twelve days from now he's going to be on the on the same page with Tom Brady. Count to witness the -- and has -- the patriots dramatically different from asked the wide receivers wide receivers during an option -- on every plate but a chunk of their placed tight ends basically. Cash to hash or number two number right and that the issue issue with previous items they brought it hasn't been their ability to comprehend system it's been. And athletic but not particularly good pass -- -- just sort of yeah rights issue to me will be what Lovie Smith was talking about it throws him the ball and he drops it. And the great there's another warning you drops that at some point and finally he got up early -- all no question you know you -- -- the Zacks sub Feld wrote. Where you're you're just not helping us on the field you're hurting us that's a question but that's a that's a physical assessment that we'll all be able -- over the next month plus I just think. In terms of physical talent. You're not that worse off after this -- -- left guard my left. I think you're gonna have -- -- -- probably coming at right guard Klein at left guard and -- -- center I think you're probably back to a similar offensive line the last year with Klein -- -- for Mankins that would be my guess is how they start the year. I don't think that's good. What. The pass protection for run blocking -- I don't think that's -- cut I think -- I think in the running game I think Logan Mankins is a impressive road -- of a guard he can poll he can lead out in space he's athletic. I think in pass protection. He's had a number of hiccups dating back years now. That have hurt this team so I'm not sure how much you lose there. And as you keep saying you you've added a weapon at a position of major need. And the upside of that weapon you know everybody's getting excited that you split backs and you -- those two back sets wishing Vereen. Maybe now they -- -- backs and too tight end sets with ground Ian -- as the move tight -- -- one tight and field would be an upgrade from what they -- in the pre season your tone is very pessimistic you know I don't mean to be that way. Our -- patriot nation thinks it's your turn you've heard. Our opinions. A little diverse thereto for our opinions 6177797937. We hear what you think coming up next.

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