Jul 23, 2014|
Albert Breer,NFL Network, reported that Bill Belichick would like to win a Super Bowl after Tom Brady retires. The thought is that Bill is always trying to build his legacy and if he could win an additional title with a QB other than Brady, it would put him in an even higher echelon of coaches. MFB discuss the coaching greats of NFL's past, and decide if Belichick needs to accomplish more to eclipse them.
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Sick army days then had to be lots of patriots talked to start today as one would imagine what with the beginning of training camp in Foxborough will be out their broadcasting live. I'm Friday some baseball talk coming up at noon what -- only of espn.com. An update on the Cole Hamels situation in Philadelphia firm handle what they're not the Red Sox will be effective what's going on what Jake Peavy. As well plus David Ross scheduled to join us in the 1 o'clock hour. A night -- seven to be higher on the Red Sox as while bullets step with a patriot secession for the time being guys. If you haven't been listening for the first hour the big story today is that Rob Gronkowski will not be placed on pop. He will be cleared medically to participate. -- was suggesting -- real easy on him in practice niner practice in and all in some situations. And we were looking through the text messages and a lot of people -- texting into the eighteenth -- text -- Don't Plame until the middle the season don't Plame until late in the year ago Plame until November. He's gonna get her at some point you -- all sixteen and won't be able to be. Healthy for the playoffs and that's the bigger deal so you think that that's a good idea don't hold back playing Gradkowski into the middle of the season 617. 7797937. Another -- related item that we had planned on getting to yesterday and we didn't because of the dungy Michael Sam discussion that got so intense. We never brought up what Albert careers said on Comcast. And if you missed some of his comments career. Stated that it's his belief. And he's got some sort of vibe coming from within the patriots that Bill Belichick would like. To win a Super Bowl at some point without Tom Brady. I don't think it yet any problem with the way you work with the patriots eventually would you like to prove that you went with a different quarterback. Yes. You know I think that stopping that Betemit but seems operate on the door and I don't want anybody of us for that but I mean I think there's like a key component to all of this -- some day what you -- be able oh boy at the Lombardi trophy. But it pecking -- -- that would put him in a different lap of -- has absolutely. Prayer went on to say that in essence this is a legacy -- garbage. Get a sense of history and do I think he cares about how he's remembered aggregate absolute. Like in the book what would this -- -- spam that's why did documentary would that help build. I mean you like the player aren't biting his own history and I and I think like a cute but it's important on. And part of the reason why it's a legacy debate according to Albert is that if he were to win a Super Bowl would be different quarterback. It's not so much he needs that to establish his own legacy the legacy is written but it would put him in a class above some of the other greats issue. -- legacy one part of February with a completely different team to get accomplished that the deck down the line to me if there's one way to use separate yourself from Vince Lombardi. And Chuck -- And Bill Walsh. If you win with another order that -- also what Joseph Montana Chuck Noll Terry Bradshaw. And bombard -- only well Bart Starr. So you know to me to be another avenue -- and a separate belt like -- But Joseph -- Well about a deal gives three to record straight right. Nobody nobody talks about him that there's a -- -- which he says you're saying that it's a better go to your daily -- gives now. Let's face it what's her status -- I don't drop Mike can try before you play it out try to figure has any coach. The Eagles did it as editor Bennett coat that is one. With -- here. I guess star cornerback who kind of had some sort of but Chinese the going on and your point is that yes Joseph -- did it yet he's not recognized in the same level as all those guys that we are just rattle off. Right yeah I knew what I think you're under preside in an advisor and thighs and Doug Williams and Mark Martin written are so he kind of left -- and that was like news franchise quarterback and I wouldn't put -- and in there the rest motivated excited right and let's that I would win one after -- and that was the Big Apple and I think that's kind of it is kind of important bill me. It just doesn't care and the obvious answers he doesn't care about anything he just visible. Improving every day its its the it is what it is it's gave you don't think he does Canada have an idea on -- what to think he would care that. You know who makes so. Most bill as a head coach before it Tom Brady Brees made Bill Belichick you know that talk or is it about text mate -- Up to -- can go anywhere else. To prove that he can win with another head coach but I do think deep down bill wants to show maybe that's one of the reasons why. He started maybe a year to early may be a rounder too too soon to pick a quarterback he wants to start it now if he's gonna win after what Tom Brady. He knows he's gonna need a quarterback so you want to start early and he wants to grab a little bit tired -- in the draft the -- most people are -- more comfortable with. -- It's funny because when I when I was. Wiggle around and talked of these ex coaches coaches who used to. Have a head coaching job now or in TV or opposition coaches who ended up -- NFL coaching college. The conversations go all over the place and it eventually heads back to the New England Patriots like all roads and leading back to back in every coach. Was almost. Didn't necessarily. Approve the idea that build a great coach. But the idea that well he's got tiebreak I Tom Brady I would be that person that I had Joseph Montana. Outlook are out -- -- we're -- a league had a chance to have Tom Brady's six times though they chose not to point taken. My point is. Is that these coaches kind of like. I wanna knocked down bill. Or at almost the valuing his success. Based on the fact that he had Tom Brady where we all know that that's not the case. However. I do think that it would be important. And I think it's important to him to win a suitable -- -- general OK just to be able to start out. Driving out that while we coast Buffalo Bills. We ever go to -- that could that team gets -- -- job by -- and -- a -- in their -- -- -- like. If you're Jon Bon Jovi and I know your -- -- my buddy you're the one of the best coaches ever coached and they keep it solid -- -- like three years -- you can -- Police get the base get a foundation set. And have a one year assistance maybe can't take over I don't is not there yet. That's before we've discussed this felt like I what are you ever go anywhere else. Has a big key is. Coaches who get out of coaching at the right time. -- saved their legacies so if Tom Brady retires. And Bill Belichick -- the same time while there's really no debate. At least will never have a chance to debate a couple we never saw him try to do it somewhere else. It's Lombardi went back bill -- went back to college Chuck Noll never did Joseph Gibbs came back failed miserably out on the team but he failed miserably right. What's his legacy right now. What happened what -- you brought up Joseph Gibbs on her own his legacy is still the guy that won three super balls even though he failed miserably. If Phil Jackson where I don't put himself on the bench for the New York Knicks and they don't win even -- they have Carmel does that tarnish his legs so sooner did the Chicago and Los Angeles and it's a win win situation -- thought that the legacy I just. So I might try wave in the moment discussion we don't have the perspective of knowing what we're gonna think ten years ago -- -- Here's announced a terrific Bill Belichick was a great coach regardless of -- do know you do I do what we act like we don't and I think it's a ridiculous question. Supposedly a huge sum that you think it's right that Belichick does feel the need. To win without break down on myself and it is I think that is it is not agree with -- saying that I think that isn't it is important to him. It's one of those things are okay. Always look for the next challenge to war I guess to challenge yourself. And and you said before Belichick team here it's -- putting problems have gone exactly well. I don't beat now would be a greater -- fell almost beat tougher because. Always gonna do that legacy -- Green Bay homered to left on the cart became and far left Rogers came in. All new staff general match and everything and they are able to do with a whole new rule mindset and a whole new set up philosophical beliefs. It will Louis talk about legacy you a lot of it is outsiders looking in. Right in judging about people looking at bill Belichick's -- Manning Brady's legacy. And we forget to look at the inside looking out we have to get a look at the can be extremely competitive individual. Maybe it means that bill. On a personal level or maybe -- some it to him just to what they're competitive flights together competitive individual in Bill Belichick. To show himself. As well as others. -- he doesn't just need to numbered peaking yet he himself can gloat. It would is you'll go to -- and we always look at the outside looking down but a lot of these guys know how does it affect the legacy of Peyton Manning -- I'm pretty sure Peyton Manning insiders say the same thing I wanna win noticeable right now. You don't -- he's competitive he wants -- -- and thinking about outsiders think about himself but how he feels about himself the competitiveness inside some these guys these athletes. Or Gallagher Bill Belichick. That -- -- don't look at that we just the media. -- -- it's harder what do you think is -- because a week I kind of touched on just a little bit and don't lose date what is harder. Winning as staying at staying at a Dallas that your father. You know -- this -- successful business. Okay he he wills it to you he gives its view. Is it harder for a guy to take over that whole that whole business and keep going keep thriving. Odd yet more respect in his car for that got to do that or they got a dozen from scratch obviously it's harder to do from scratch I don't know -- that's a 100% I don't know what was your definition of success though. Well I mean I guess if if if bill is it is it easier my dad all Microsoft. And -- Microsoft to make you just Bruce brought into the ground. -- -- -- -- and dug a hole it -- -- -- and Microsoft is worth nothing because you just completely or there's a risk of failure by US -- from the standpoint of attaining a higher level of success or tedium a team more personally gratifying level of success the more personally -- level of success to be start your business and have become the next Microsoft. Yeah but I think that's just as far as what's tougher to do I think they're both. -- the only way got to see what this that there's this organization looks like you know three or four years from now when Tom Brady is gone. Because you know when he left. He left Cleveland a Teamsters and Baltimore Ravens seasonable there was some pieces that were being built to create this team that wins a simple. You can look at a bad team -- bill might look at NC you know what they've had a better record. Limited -- twelve. That's a better situation the next two or three years and here in New England. You know so he could say well like he left doing political report twelve team but really deep down when you look at it it's that would be a better situation in the near future they get kind of look at. What it is you know I think for him it's going to be with -- without Tom Brady if that's really what it comes down -- in just for people outside for him himself to prove to himself. That the criticism you're talking about like always -- Tom Brady but he can win. I think you almost look at table for the last ten years is that Tom Brady. And isn't any really help. The side of the football that Bill Belichick is the genius is where he -- failed. He's left it all on twelve shoulders. Note Tom Brady's quarterback puts a big numbers and Bill Belichick the defensive genius with a guy like Tom Brady should be able to put a defense together and hasn't. It cut all it was in transition and it still hasn't gotten back there that's -- you look at this year saying. There's a lot of pressure on bill. I'm not gonna say Matt Patricia the Bill Belichick you've got the personnel write that defense should be. The one of the better defense in the league should no longer be thirtieth in yards sixteenth in points it should be fifteenth in yards. Fourth in points with the personnel you have right now there's no more excuses after the pressures for him this year. 617779793. Set and Albert brought up the -- Chuck -- I can't imagine on chuck Knowles deathbed a couple of weeks ago here's takes himself way I really wish it would have gone out -- one of the Super Bowl now Bradshaw. I I I guess obviously but. If if you're young -- if you -- energized enough and you have I guess the mental make up to conduct start over again. Then it would be something that I think is intriguing you just look at that Steve -- -- sorry Ron Amadon needed to win what would Bill Walsh to solidify bill Walsh's legacy to think well they could do himself that. I needed to have young when one for me. As opposed to see what you think about when you think about the great coaches Super Bowl winning coaches. All of them except Joseph Gibbs. Did it. With the same quarterback the hall of fame once in a lifetime type quarterback a Joseph Montana. Eight men. Terry Bradshaw. And Joseph Montana at any -- for all the did it. With the same guy I think more than I think you'll be fantastic -- it was so much fun to watch and I think. Is -- going to make or break -- one in his life if he doesn't know nodded not at all but -- point. I think the legacy is important I think history is important. -- -- -- I just take what you said. It would be even more important more fun to see him stay here and do with a brand new quarterback that he hand picks that he drastic but he molds and NC. When he condemned by Bill Belichick I don't waste 12. Of my life thinking about that we will look at Phil Jackson. Phil Jackson people us the same thing about it while -- while Michael Jordan. But -- -- -- LA and -- and they was put Kobe jackets W -- won't Kobe Jack figured chased this nonstop. Because well our upload turns and Andre -- communities of nonstop and then also well judiciary should be coach of an accident. No I don't I don't know no let coach know managers know it whatever any sport is that one tip to craft teams. No no no great NFL coach. There's been great because -- much crap players and when it's a global. Is that it was very good players so it's it's it's tough thing to determine -- you can do it is move on from a great quarterback. It show you can do it again and it says grapple it turns and Brady and symbolic just fell into. They say it's Favre did Rogers it just fell into -- Montana all Harlem. You -- -- -- Clark now given the name right back even today when Ron Amadon Ron Amadon yes but candidates and young. What is left Alabama again that's yours I guess -- volume Thursday. -- the nonverbal communication was still building in this guy you know it'll always be that right having a couple of to be great quarterback but I just fell into. That is really is there a way to judge the degree I think he's a great coach. But I do think there's been whispers about -- with a defensive side of the football and boy this year projected Foxboro hijacker -- 9%. What you have when -- it would I tried to figure out what about how to -- this actually got to comment. All the talking about bill dollar check in his legacy. It spent ten years and he can't win with Brady so what does it matter -- -- with someone out. And not secondly they're not the only one that thinks Michael they're immediately be at a Belgrade at wide receiver. You're not the first person years of bad joke. As to your point about it I like that. No which -- -- his own head -- -- to -- like like a school oil OK so -- if the if bill really is if he really was. Just obsessed with his legacy and securing it. That data Brady retires. He retires. People. Because you nothing will ever change your -- high when he recited to select the Super -- but you still have all these records are undefeated season. But it can't get ticketed to take you back -- can it be up for debate about that actually that. Before stupid ass joke one thing you brought up that actually was worth debating is what does that say about your legacy to go ten years between championships -- to -- -- with the same person will the same quarterback. Now how many coaches have we -- ten years in between titles. With the same team gal I guess I don't I don't. Get all over him for that is because and you want to assume let's say that's an accomplishment if -- ten years and. -- AFC title games Darren. But I Aaron thing. What success -- back of the what is success six AFC title game it is -- They've they've hit some biggest argument for well over ten years to -- -- point dates that actually brought a couple points in the first one. Was the defense. So I guess the question is. With this defense. It is bill allowed any excuses. Sports that the failure of this defense again you know with all the players that he has finally the transitioning out of Teddy Bruschi Vrabel Rodney the whole crew. -- gone and he finally had enough -- that you start off and now you kind of breeze into this. You know missiles as -- is a lot of first round draft -- to Mike Reese points on his column challenge Jones. Visible for Dominique -- Jerod Mayo dot -- high tower. Darrelle Revis the demo -- I mean -- you slot Rob Ninkovich indeed because it was really like a first round pick in my book. So media excuses a raft of bad for the -- for even have a practice. -- coach no excuses -- so we expect from. Fair to say or not. Yes. Yeah I mean at this. Oh yes -- and the three -- last year three previous seasons are. Pass defense have been thirtieth 31 and 29. -- jumped eighteen gates it will keep the -- with a big factor in that. You know it and overall offense it's just the discussion what's what's more important points or yards you don't everybody's got a little thing of because they give up so many yards. Because the 31 32 in the league on his closet that doesn't mean anything because I'm an area the -- too bad that so gonna ignore that. -- when the reality is the more yards you give up. Guilty kick up the field -- down as you are given up some yards. They sustainable drive to keep Tom Brady off the field. You know a time of possession. So yards matter a little better understand it the ball points where they usually fifteenth sixteenth and ammo pack. With this personnel that going to be good enough is going to be bend but don't break. What ninth in the league in yards fifteenth in point is that the defense fall Camilla packed today beat there no. Is is it possible to see fifteenth Miller packing yards. And third or fourth in points. With the personnel they have with one of the most impact but the threat to players in the league in Darrelle Revis that's money should be. Spent but don't break things that can apply this year. -- techsters bring up a good point speaking of defense and connection to Belichick trying to chase multiple championships with different quarterbacks would -- reference Parcells when he was -- and hostetler is the obvious connection there between. Belichick and Parcells. Maybe that's something that's weighing his mind because it is Parcells and -- in New England connection there to. I don't know to me I wouldn't worry about it post part if I was Bill Belichick will be -- -- concern at them on my mind but at some point this is all gonna come to an end I mean at some point you will have to make a decision now. This is it builds data gasket coats and so they they've been -- he can't walk anymore that's the last thing and he's he's just a culture it's in -- -- that's what he -- he's awesome man. So anywhere he goes can automatically. Give a team a better chance to win just by just. Being having used his up in order Abbott is everything in order and -- you know to tell guys what to do and in philosophy and everything else it -- been great are we come back just in question was raised before we started the show today. There's going to be one NFL team is going to stun the league this year. We'll tell you who it is we come back and why next on 37 W yeah.