WEEI>On Demand>>Buster Olney says the Lester negotiations are getting ugly and may be spilling over to the rest of the clubhouse. 7-02-14

Buster Olney says the Lester negotiations are getting ugly and may be spilling over to the rest of the clubhouse. 7-02-14

Jul 2, 2014|

We discuss the ongoing Jon Lester contract saga, and add in the new wrinkle that the lack of the deal may not be sitting right with the rest of the team.

Transcript - will not be 100% accurate

Well. I would say that the the Red Sox are sticky with sweat but it might be flop sweat -- my -- actually. Son's -- might be flop sweat the way this summer's gone as tight as they tweet it out last night. I mean hell they're scored a coach you are now worried deep deep trouble and then after the game he says that might be some fatigue issues are all well. You know. Let's start with coach you for a second. Isn't a surprise to anybody is that a surprise as have been saying for weeks now if you have an opportunity not. Gonna be in contention and they're just on that they're on the verge of being in contention and and on the verge of being in last place to now Tampa only two games behind I think it's was it one of the loss column anyway. If if you're on the verge of that and got coach your car. And teams are interested -- in him. It makes a lot of sense to move on because he's going to be forty years old and he's already had some shoulder problems but now. Now he's talking about. Fatigue. And he looks more more mortal than he has in the past year maybe trade value there for him is not what it was. Few weeks ago well it would have to be through the -- witness what I consider probably the last two years the best closer in baseball which most definitely the last year so well yeah the last Cadillac darling here when I can't believe he got the job he's been clearly the best closer so you can really. You know hold somebody yup which team now would be you know research a little bit Morrissey who gets the sweaty hands but I think if you look at it. That would be the epitome of three's white flag because those -- -- what you do Miller becomes a closed Euro you know I'm not sure exactly as our boxes out what my guess would be Miller. I mean just based on how it's on right now in. What appears to be as make up that would be my guess it could beat his album I'm guessing Andrew Miller with the dutchess -- write up I mean you already have a feeling for with field field in the lineups here fielding right now -- -- starting to be. A little bit -- parents who we got from the kids but. If you made a deal. Who aren't that would be raising a white flag there. I'll be one of the things -- another one would be and we'll get to it that it this is blown -- -- and I don't like the idea but I don't mean in last night we talked about it you know like the idea that. Another another raise the white flag scenario symbol would be. Doing something with with Jon Lester expect it to happen but I can't sit here. On the Titanic Titanic reference I can't figure on the Titanic. That okay. The iceberg has been hit OK it's taking on water. I see rats scurrying in Atlanta. People are freaking out and I visitors. -- expect Jon Lester back here how many times. Do we have to hear not a buster Olney is out there a couple of times. That you know Jon Lester is not necessarily happy with how things have gone today he said. It is 89 point five that it did and terms. Again. Rank or agitation. And -- Something to -- five they intend on satisfaction. Yet things things aren't going too well now I don't expect. Don't expect. Jon Lester could be anywhere next year except for Boston on a full time basis but. What does this mean is it is it a no brainer that's not a no brainer. Is it is it to the point where. It and wanna talk to him anymore you resigned to going to free agency in wanna play for the Red Sox and the army hop how bad is it. I got a feeling it's bad -- one of the things buster talked about his has been one of my concerns is what's the what's the feeling in the clubhouse. And and bullets look listen to buster first in and hear exactly what he told the guys on MF be. I can tell you that. That there is any level of frustration on western side. Animal that John himself for people around them because I'd never. Being around negotiations it's gotten more attention from other players in the team in this Lester talked a frustration level. Of the other guys on this team and the red -- about how this is played out he is at a nine point five at a -- Because they don't get it and night you know there is -- perception among the other players -- -- -- that the Pedroia contract last year. Almost reset the expectations of Red Sox ownership. That's interest especially when you talk about who in the locker room would be showing that kind of dissatisfaction with the way masters being treated men -- we talk about often is when guy takes a discount. And that doesn't do the other guys in the club also favor. Well buck was -- the story he was in New York over the weekend and he was telling us the story that in the clubhouse after Lester pitched that sparkling game. Against Tanaka and 121. That he's standing their meeting with the media and what's it peavy -- any -- these and out of that you can now met now need to pay 85 million dollars you know be in a Smart Alec about it Lester kind of rolling his eyes. I can see where the guys in the clubhouse or -- -- You're not gonna keep back. A -- that I it would it would be like and in the patriots have done this on a number of occasions saying about a lawyer Malloy. And all of a sudden everybody in the in the dressing promise say wait a minute. Lawyer Malloy is gold. And and you can see where this kind of a trickle down effect. And you have to have someone behind lawyer Malloy you Rodney Harrison to make that move. Seemingly something you can be saved from bright -- and I don't know if Jon Lester is at but I find it interesting and that's the one of the dirty little secrets about doing a deal and I'm reading and actually -- book by John Feinstein on. Glavine. And Mike we've seen from few years back -- on the black living on black. And it talks about mussina doing team friendly deals with Baltimore while glad I'm looking at that deal done and kind of submarine that. When you have that kind element I mean Jake -- not sure exactly injuries. Everybody's favorite guy and clubhouse but. Where does he get off the dollars he's collecting this year. Lobbying for Jon -- Well but you know maybe maybe he's lobbying for Jon Lester not even thinking that disease -- -- that the Red Sox have paid him. Seven million dollars for one win. Yeah that's a cop -- and -- what whatever whatever his whatever his salary is not at this point in the season in July. I pretty much pap report -- over seventy this year he's scheduled to make for today -- you have 49 dollar pitcher. Who has one win four -- wins don't matter and on and pitching most of but. He's got one win. And you are re. Slightly under five. Just under five. And he I think he he looked at it as being a good teammate is bigger than Jake Peavy I don't think I would just be adding it just having and they -- comes down to. His teammates -- his teammates. Looking at him knowing what he has done for this organization. Overall in his career when he did for this organization last year knowing everybody knowing that he is there rates. And in the Red Sox are sending a very confusing message. To Lester and the rest of the players and -- -- we mentioned -- For whatever reason OKZ hasn't gotten it together this year but he is making these guys he's gonna make fourteen million dollars. Stephen Drew. It got to make ten million dollars with the Red -- they they are not opposed to paying people real money and not opposed to overpay. Their players when it comes to Jon Lester. What are they trying to say are -- trying to say that they don't wanna hear. Are they trying to say that. He'll just take anything he'll take any deal -- throughout their so -- throughout seven million dollars I don't understand. I do think people. Got upset when I said that the the initial Red Sox offer was an insult because let's be honest for all of us seven million dollars is gonna take care of us. And our kids and our grandkids and you know we would go through life. Happy as clams. Buddy in that world which is different -- our world and different from everybody else's world in that world. Billable. And it was like well what the hell let's see what he says and and I thought -- depiction of that today was perfect he said if you're looking to buy a house. And you and you go so far under what the list prices so far under what the cops are. The real estate agent he's isn't in -- call you back because they don't think you're seriously think he's obviously it's a 500000 dollar house effort to 200000 dollars for. I mean this is ridiculous. And I don't think that we did in the clubhouse that's where their sank. You're gonna tell him that's what he's worth. But you know I think another issue and made it may go beyond Jon Lester. And in the offered that was that was given to him that was proposed to him. If you can always you can look at these this. Dynamic one of two ways. Guys and her contract year. Hey they got something a pro. They're going to be -- -- market next year will be inspire will be focused war guys -- a contract year they're thinking about number one forget about the team. And it -- it can lead to me. A pretty dysfunctional. Clubhouse if you have too many guys like that so -- was on the counter here for the Red Sox Jon Lester in the contract year. Jonny Gomes in the contract year AJ Pierzynski. Is in a contract year. You know was open up. Until it's 311. Guy what one guy I'm sick if you if you look at the roster. And most secure. Maybe David Ortiz -- get to secure Dustin Pedroia is secure. I don't know what how they view Shane Victorino right now one more year left in a contract Mike Napoli is secure. I mean you got some guys -- -- -- John Lackey is in a contract year do you think about that let -- get to your best to starting pitching. Lackey and Lester especially. Now for different reasons I have a little sympathy for Lackey because he did sign the contract and humanities agent -- in the -- -- the Red Sox but. He's got a contract. And he is ready to pitch next year he's ready to go the contracts has yet to pitch for the Major League medal. And veteran and -- in baseball has got to pick for the venom. Being brought org you just don't have to pitch mr. -- gonna make more money he -- next year. So when you look at that which well clusters has -- most of the notoriety in conversation including buster today. Which do you see as the greater injustice in need of immediate and pressing I would think Lester Lester okay. I think you can make a case. For Lackey in the fact that. Look if I'm Lester I don't make my money somewhere. If I'm lacking. It's either make it right or right or debacle so I have you when I have you would screw your territory if you want to. Make bridges and solve wounds in that dug in that club house. I would fake address in the Lackey situation is more -- which got to go back to the point you made earlier which was the perfect point about the only lawyer -- second by. The patriots had to back up plan and they had Rodney Harrison ready to step into the position and and and. Played a heck up okay. If Lackey and Lester left right now at the end of the year they walked away. -- -- Lester somewhere else in the free agent market. Play. Think about it because I thought colts in your face about a guy who can't stay healthy can't stay on the field. As has pitched great his last two outings to see it. That's -- -- all of a sudden ruby Della Rosa. Works. Felix you Ron I mean think about 73 scenario and he burial and Aaron Henry Owens who's still at double for crying out. And looks great and you know Portland playing great. But you're gonna tell me any of those guys are going to be. What Jon Lester physical any of them to interject and take a look around at what we're seeing in the in the lineup on a nightly basis with Brent -- junior. You bet and you know proper Holtz always this trending toward him not really read in the few leaves. Full line. Type of now argue it throw it can't do it because this place when it runs right I don't know you can bring it out until I looked at what I mean think about why -- -- they're gonna have a -- because I use it within the worst team -- the master was the average looked -- have a bunch of guys next year on this roster making. But baseball standard speed it's okay they're gonna have a bunch of young guys make in low salaries. They can block and pay Jon Lester. 23 million a year when I got committed at your seventy million dollars that's that's the number that we came up with the other -- Ehrlich -- seven game and their at a 150 some now. Now they've got I think six arbitration guys in there that's fine. But the got a bunch of guys whose money goes off the books. And bunch guys you you're not going to be bringing back. I would pay Lackey and I would Lester because I don't think I've got somebody better. I would pay Lester I'm not so I'm not so sure about Lackey. Depending on. I mean depending on what he wants how he sees himself at this point in his career. He's not a free agent. And in his in his mid thirties. We sort of is a free agent but he is not because if they don't if that -- and this is me talking not him talking wanna stressed that. If they don't wanna address that if they say hey John sorry does that account signed the deal 500000 city of Fort Myers the trial and he says you know what I'm good thanks policy. So in a way he has a free agent he can afford to walk he's made a hundred million dollars over his career. And I know that there is that -- yes there's that I don't know I don't know what can I understand. But if he is a this is why. The contract is what it is a free agent knows all right like Jon Lester. A free agent to be. I know my skill level lives. I'd know what people placed what people pay starting pitchers. Major League Baseball. So you can army to a contract or not if you don't army took contract item free right and I know a lot take somebody else's money. John Lackey can be pissed off -- you be upset angry can try to shame and guilt them whatever it is under contract. And if he doesn't pitch he's not do himself any favors -- -- to go to somebody it's not like somebody else -- we're gonna say they don't worry about it John. We'll -- you up fourteen million dollars over the next three years can't majority. If you're in the pistol club -- about some of these innings million dollar offer with them. About department in matching making someone taken on 5000. I mean. When someone not named -- on -- I mean a guy like John Lackey and the teams and -- sorry. So this crap that happened team's not doing. This -- the -- if you Alice and you have a club house would GP -- I don't know from enemy does know me but. The comments like that when you walk around the outside knows Romany -- like that. What is your main motivation right now what is left of the -- worth more than what they've offered when he pitches a great game -- walk in no time but it's not just that game. But when you're talking about that when you make -- point -- -- -- -- reports immediately you're saying the important thing here at right we have an opportunity yet. To do well here and get some momentum in the but the bigger point motivation -- -- the united it makes reporters on the -- That Jon Lester is getting screwed over here make sure everybody's got that direct opposite to do list when they talk about this game. And I think that is what happens team which won in infections and would older starts to seeped through when -- ten games under 500. Those new eating your partner I. I -- I don't know that I'd pack your foot melodies come -- on -- but at the top of my list. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- And and the irony here is we're talking about pitching we -- off talking about Jon Lester and John Lackey and the bottom line here is this team can't it'll. It's not pitching that's the problem they pitched great last night cliff Buchholz was terrific continued to. I mean Koji obviously did not have a good ninth -- I understand that if you think about how many times has he appeared for in the last calendar year how many bad ones as he had. -- probably do one now and again and I hope that the fatigue issue is something they'll be taken terabyte not problem tonight. But how do you fix the problem we have right now you can't hit and it's funny because we talked about this with -- bats coming. Do you run the risk then I'll bring in -- -- in two quick bringing him bringing him put him at them on the Major League stage before he's ready and hurting. And it's -- Bogart's. Who right now is in a slump of epic proportions and looks totally lost and I heard John -- talking about it a bit after the game last night. I mean he works on things in the cage -- early batting in that he doesn't take it out on the field he looks lost right. He does and so does the entire. Pretty much the entire team now. Put your idea. It is starting to come out of it a little bit. -- got screwed last night at the end there was nothing definitive on that. Mean one angle -- look like he was saved the other angle I was a tie you know you don't let settled yet but nothing yet I tie goes to a runner. He's coming out of it a bit but you know you look at it up and down the lineup. A lot of guys. Who when they come up to the plate you say okay it's going to be something good here this guy's gonna have a good approach and and. And they'll be fine -- -- the elements to deal with too is when you have that kind youth in this some Steve -- the bottom post game. Last night when you have that kind of youth clustered together at the bought. Of the lineup and and guys who won here -- Stephen Drew and included net group. It's harder because you go up there with I have to do it because again behind these knock him when you have them interest persons was going to vote. But Q bets that deadlines may even if you're struggling a little bit maybe put him up in the lineup I know we struggling I -- -- young. But put him up in the line -- so he has that idea of what it's not on me the guy behind -- might be Pedro Taylor for enemy of Pedroia were behind me is Mike Napoli. It's shot went up that way because they think would you have a lot of guys who say if you're even could rail or Mike Napoli is saying to yourself. Well I don't do -- I'm gonna go to that dead spot where it's three straight out. Plus one and we're gonna was a full inning with that group of the -- inning last night. When it was Zander Bogart's in Stephen Drew in net and you go on OK to sit out of course I've been at right back -- to the field. But I think it's interesting you're gonna have to start -- when asked you know John -- that about that a little Bluetooth thirty shoot you interspersed. Some of the guys who are slumping and young with the other ones that they do feel as if OK it's not on me the guy behind me could pick me up. I'll be curious to see. I mean. I don't know how many more moves they've got internally to make here. You had a party get this this 21 year old kid. Who started the year at double late here in the Major League roster and playing every night different positions every night it seems -- playing every night. -- -- party they started a a three rookie outfield. For the first time outside of September call since 1987. I think -- -- right for some 27 years salt so I don't know how many more moves there are internally how many more guys can you bring up. From double layer AAA and ask and a here save us we were going down the drain here. Well. I think we've said before that that can gain. Road trip started know a lot more about the Red Sox. After this road trip and turn out to be falls to them look like we were we're about -- team just think. They went to New York had two wins in those seven games. Going to New York or more games you know that I can win that here's what they do they turn around. Turn -- when the series so not a point six and that road trip okay not a disaster not great -- that kind of treading water hanging around. It's just close -- where they should be able to make a run but they're bad enough where they can't make up significant ground and now considered again. In game homestand. We'll know a lot more about the Red Sox got -- to game homestand. And we'll know a lot more tonight -- -- wind up getting swept the whole. At home. That's a real problem. If they come out this series of five runs scored they get a clone tool. I can tell you that. That there is any level of frustration on lesser side. Animal that John himself for people around them because I'd never. I've been around -- negotiation it's gotten more attention from other players in the team in this Lester talked -- frustration level. The other guys on this team -- the red -- about how this has played out he is at a nine point five at Japan. I heard Tim bans on middays with MF -- suggest that it was the fans' fault that the Lester negotiations are at the state that the era. Because you're buying the tickets you're spending the money. You know that that it your the the problem. And and yet it's kind of funny because you just heard buster -- who was on middays with them at -- say that. If this thing does get off the the impasse that the -- it might be the other players in the in the Red Sox clubhouse who actually push this thing off the the dime here that. You get enough reaction in the clubhouse to get enough guys and what the hell's going on here I mean that's our best picture and has been our best pitcher for awhile now. And and you're not getting this thing done what where we go on what are we doing with this thing -- be funny I think that if it was the other players on the on the team got the signal. -- terms there where else heard them. Try to challenge by guy Adam from Auburn and think about him. Tell me you don't know you don't do it challenge acts like one of my guys. -- And out of you know you lose in the fight vandalism bites together into. -- OK we got to go we gotta go here. Let out. It's not the is not the -- entirely you know my players make a lot of money for the TV contract. The TV contract if you want you to thank you very much the whole family Q thank you as the great. You guys are people here and -- activities you hear it you really get me getting me emotional here. But is that you know it is opposite. TV the TV contract. That's what it is right that would all the money is and that's where all the money is in the game. With 30000 seats out there it's not as if he has come -- -- -- it did not Britain that's like every team in baseball has more money than they expected to -- it it's all TV deals. Why the LA Dodgers are are swimming in cash and could -- to the -- not yet. -- take Josh Beckett and Carl Crawford and Adrian Gonzales is simply not can't find the dodgers' games on TV out just -- matter got the money that that's the that's the first thing the other thing is. I don't know -- -- buster Olney is respected. Reporter and I think. His sources are spot on what buster really does. Or should have been a salesman. More than journalist. But that's hyperbole better than anybody who memories that I ever written at the very. Armor Manny Ramirez. That was the worst thing I've -- and all my years ago in baseball well on steroid era hello and I -- Like the there was like the black Sox scandal and -- -- -- The worst negotiations I have never seen this is the hottest day of the year -- -- -- local woman I've ever seen on and on compound. Back to below by all down. -- with that not everything went yeah. I mean we did it once I hope I think. That's my. In this. Endeavor wide well I spew -- I think you have. This situation I think the situation is gonna is gonna work out. Is just the Red Sox gonna wind up paying a lot more money than they wanted to. Why would say this I I am surprised when when people call the radio station the number of people who are willing to elect Jon Lester take a hike. -- and and it may be the vocal minority I don't know you know maybe the majority of people out there. Think like I do that that's the best pitcher may have if he's not here you gotta replace him with somebody. You you know it's better to pay for what you know. A guy you know can pitch in the American League east a guy you know compared to Fenway Park a guy you know can pitch in the post season. Why wouldn't you want to bring him I don't know but I'm amazed us and they -- -- Max Scherzer was gonna cost you more than Lester maybe he's better than last year at this point I mean we can we would have to make that determinedly different got a 140 from Detroit so. What's it gonna cost you to bring sure 350. But it 160. But if you're going to establish that he used to Jon Lester for whatever reason is worth half of that seven you with your initial offer. Then you have to figure OK that there's a -- is something they don't like about him in the front office because his jaw and is John -- said the last hour. There's only so -- you can put on the table for someone so obviously John Ferrell and his teammates or lecture on masters day. But it's not as if Jon Lester goes someplace else -- -- let go someplace I don't criticize the pick for this personal. Guys that -- is spreading ownership got scared off by some contract yet that it -- in the backs. Think it comes down to that it's as simple as that they think that it's a a bad business model and it may be a bad business model and maybe. But it's what it's what it takes to sign Jon Lester he can't decide now. When Jon Lester is up okay now we're gonna show we're gonna exercise some some. Restraint. We're just gonna keep it took four years and seventy million dollars or 75 or eighty million dollars that's -- gonna do because we just don't believe and it was not. Perfect time to do because John masters they could do very good pitcher but -- great pitcher hall of Famer. He's not the winds are -- let's go but I'm not perfect now telling us. Here's what we draw the -- a -- let's not look at pay exorbitant pay you might -- word okayed a very good that you're not gonna sign matures or you're gonna go find a great ones are right email sent. I don't I don't I am I'm trying to let him -- here -- structures are great. What makes some great he's he's a great picture -- who what's what who's upside is better it at their respective ages. And winning I don't know but maybe it's this situation last year for the Red Sox last year -- Because he's been here before he's he's gonna do what I never come -- when they got used to it upside you're opera it's all based on a projection everything's based objection right he's going to be -- -- look at projection of Jon Lester who spent his entire career with the Red Sox and has performed Fenway Park has performed in the American League east -- entire Korean. And I know what I'm gonna get the air where it's Max Scherzer. He's got a side. But Jon Lester and have a side beaten Jon Lester it's pitch in the World Series and one. Back certainly haven't done that on the garment at all into the computer and say. I'm probably gonna get similar performances from these guys but I know -- get Jon Lester. So political wildcard with Macs -- are coming from the American League central to the American League east. I don't know him as well unless you don't know anything you never gonna go anywhere I -- -- -- we can't twist that around knowledge about it the project -- -- -- the projection to protect or any very good pitcher and -- certainty of the projection of take. Source of all people would draw lines on line. Jon Lester on a team that's clearly rebuilding I think that's down amateur at your best -- you -- you don't draw a line under when you're glad that I'll bet you would be. Kevin gamble on the Celtics was their best scorer. In the nineties when you -- them okay Kevin a rebuilding team this is a rebuilding team like that are not yet to gamble is the basketball version of John I'm giving you. In parallel. Not. He direct. Him and that no that's terrible that's terrible we're talking about the best picture on it. An average of all averaged it was worth of baseball at one world what everything what if he used to Jon Lester what a jobless numbers good pitcher very good pitcher. -- on the minds right now what people say mine all right aren't so as part of those guys -- -- and diamond doesn't give my 140 million. I don't think it -- 240 at the 815100. And money. Which it modular or did you get to watch him. Pitch with Jackie Bradley junior brought Cole. You know few -- and whatever -- collection of people behind because everybody else's he's getting -- this is a rebuilding team right now I don't. My whole jumping off point to that's his. When he said all people of all times wide Rollins seem to master -- saying because the rebuilding team and you don't wanna shoot it with one guy. But I don't think it's a rebuilding and and actually I don't and I think it is but but if you were right. And I'm with Mike on this I don't think it's a rebuilding team that they were they are the defending World Series. Understand that but they are the depending World Series champ accurate but let's say that there that a rebuilding team for the sake of our argument. That means they got a whole bunch of low salary guys all a bunch of this is a big budget big market team that has the money to pay have very good. Eight minus B plus pitcher like Jon Lester market rate. OK okay that's the. Left side of -- that's that's that's the point you can't go in the tank entirely MB of fifty to sixty win team. Because of your big market big finance thanks so that's the flip side of the okay will pay. What maybe week. Would not want to pay for domestic -- he's good to very good but we'll pay market reform because we have to have. A draw implement -- policy it doesn't fly with them doesn't fly they say were drawn the line -- you're gonna draw the line just gave dumped him but an eight year contract. -- just you talk about fiscal responsibility. Game but. But it comes to still to come -- -- years eight years. You gave you went eight years with the player then come back and say well we don't believe long term country you don't believe long term contracts. You EU -- pick and true and sometimes the decisions aren't all that Smart for example the items on the bench tonight Stephen Drew. It didn't have to pay -- two million dollars. -- -- -- Offered him a qualifying offer fourteen million dollars. He turned it down he -- the rest of the market that okay I'm document the draft pick for this guy so you know what that means and means. You want and. He didn't take the fourteen million dollars that you -- on. He's sitting out he didn't have a better offer. You don't have to do anything what do they do they even ten million dollars paying here you go take your million we don't have to go I don't know why are -- doing it we're doing it. So you got to be consistent with their stupidity I would like them to be Smart about their best talent. Jon Lester is not only there are you not only would he be the best for the Red Sox. Most teams go to a baseball it -- twenty teams he'd be the best and twenty. We're not asking him to overpay for the third or fourth or fifth starter in the rotation although they overpaid for Jake Peavy. Not their contract they acquired contract. This is a guy and I'm not -- overpay either and I do think that when he made the mistake of using the words hometown discount. I think what he -- was term. I think what he meant was five years ago instead of seven years like all the other guys are getting out there can be a hometown discount I signed for five. Now I lose money though I think loses money I know I don't I don't term I I think it's now and I think I think -- hit the nail on the head with -- -- -- Maloney who said. Right now if you were signing him today it would probably be five years 125. At the beginning of relief that the Red Sox yes for the Red Sox it if they went to him today with -- an opera five years 125 advocates say yes. And I think is to be over. Now they lose. Both in terms of finances and public perception because they went from seventy. Went 55 million dollars above that if if this sort of play out so they they are perceived to be the losers in this whole thing. I think if you went to Lester today with 5120 by the today. It -- -- that do that. I don't know if they should they do yeah yes. Of course I tell me about this let's go back with aboriginal. Championship nonsense. Let's go back that's why I'm not gonna tell you how I feel about it but the question you wonder when -- on let's correct. The record is nonsense him. Often does that happen get the operational championships in sports I mean you're the best in the league and it is an aberration. That happen. Missed in 2001. And then what happened. Missed playoffs next that would happen. But in the at this stuff frightening -- the program okay so so the aberration -- three -- -- -- Right it was an aberration was reportedly that 2000 team is that it it -- one -- -- so obviously had somebody don't build on top votes -- Tom aberration was missing the playoffs. Right. If you if you'll for what period day at a 2000. Team went file and then -- -- team and nine teams that won three championships for years in 2001 they want your operation -- the one in the one hitter could wind carries it to the level where they were very good at halftime that's -- -- what are they ever want to let this one now one instance where his stick and if you further it's ridiculous I Barbara. You know the guys who you are. Bailey who -- five -- 125 million dollar bargain right. Two years ago -- -- blog now at times it market was or read for use. Not being a leader being a follower. Being part of the problem. So low there -- a lot of guys who were part of the problem and that team okay. So again captain of the media queries. You know. Do we have a consistent track record on these are not yet -- -- the operation was that your. Was last year with the issue of the greatest players they suck all the candidates phenomenal. They're not very good to sucking again which is the aberration. Rebuilding team that is struggling around all all this beautiful Greenfield tonight that is such a Steve Buckley I'm gonna look at a three years sample when I got him available to me or seven or eight available to me how many of those are open and -- All I got a solid job -- -- -- but the team. Look at this came about last year you should you want to poke holes. The notion that this season last season's -- was an aberration. If you look over the last seven to ten years and point last year is being the trend I would say how many of the players. From that team last year were part of the organization seventh and the seven previews. While back our original argument which it's about Jon Lester two years ago was the aberration last. That was the aberration what he has what he's been one might think he will be going forward is a very good victory in us. The one year. The one -- one point two years ago operational we're talking about last. I was talking about Lester is very good -- B plus months earlier but don't wanna get them now I know because of rebuilding team. I could see the logic cannot paint but I hear how we rebuild our and get rid of your best picture -- Paper up fellows bring them up could you got to play because you've got somebody who could -- -- Well what was -- ten years ago not him. And multiple wherever -- -- -- all the whole cycle works Tom you're playing a very convenient game of LeapFrog when you say when it's about Jon Lester. And how much how much outlets are done what the team we talked about the team talk about the team. Wanna -- -- -- -- wanna watch TV and you follow it is why I wanted to jump back and talk about my point about the operational championship and twelve as though it's happened all the time in sports. We will talk about one year wonders coming up on for a fourth stop the -- 6177797937. Help one of these two sides out either Tom's side. I guess Michael and I are on the same side help one of our -- out because maybe you've got a better take on this and we view. -- 6177797937. -- telephone number dale and -- broadcasting live from Fenway Park Tommy -- is our third man in. -- by Suffolk University passion it's a requirement not an elective this Sports Radio WE yeah.

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