WEEI>On Demand>>NFL Sunday: The Richie Incognito/Jonathan Martin Blame Pie Debate Rages on

NFL Sunday: The Richie Incognito/Jonathan Martin Blame Pie Debate Rages on

Nov 17, 2013|

The infamous "bully scandal" debate makes its return on NFL Sunday and the guys have strong opinions on either end of the spectrum. Chatham thinks the media looked to make Incognito a villain immediately while Dale says that's simply because he is in fact the villain.

Transcript - will not be 100% accurate

Couple of things as we kind of go around the National Football League in this opening segment. As if things aren't bad enough for the Miami Dolphins offensive line Mike pounds he ended up in the hospital on Friday. -- kidney and gall bladder issues now he has said he hopes he can play. But and sound like a guy who would be able to go out that their party lost 40% of their bad offensive line because of the losing 60% of their bad offensive line yeah right. After losing in Tampa Bay and watching them and we're talking last week about how the could go -- one of two directions I'd be shocked if they win two Williams is here. I just that dead that to team that is just headed in the wrong direction in this is not. Setting aside all of the off field distractions that they've undergone over the last two weeks. The offensive line with the injuries it just seems to be. Just picking up steam in you know that I mean it's like a snowball and it just gets worse and worse close to -- if if you're. Fan of that team and you live down there warrior one of those guys on the team it's seamlessly snowball as you mentioned. And invariably. This comes out the back end any card you just found of being a dummy by Indian word but no audio stuff sticks. Its interest team that beat from last segment talked about the idea of this until proven guilty thing -- idea that you can be suspended until we figure out. And I just watch your back that's hampered him last week one of the biggest things they couldn't do was run the ball this sort of been their identity. And you basically taking your your best run blocker way. Based on an accusation it's looking Finneran that are residents by amendment and who knows how to -- but the point is. Those things -- affects outcomes of games and much liquid have been harping for the last two years on the defenseless receiver stuff it's not harmless and mean. Sometimes those fifteen yards -- Buying scorers and were turned games around. These off the field stuff is it just sending messages in this case it may be actually affecting the outcome of the -- at least have turned their season it's also interesting too because you've you've got a feeling coming into this season with that team based on the waiting ended last year. Based on the offseason moves it was all basically get on that September after September I mean exactly that debt was clearly are a young franchise that was headed in the right direction I think and we're doing a lot of good things and I've I've said this numerous times that. All the needed to do all that ownership needed to do with trust the process that was of course before it's you know with capital last month or so with a team because they were clearly headed in the right direction. Now I think that. Either aid to GM is gonna get fired. I think be the coach Mike if although I will say that deals already been fired they just haven't told him I thought it was interesting to hear the owner. Talk about -- And not talk about Ireland. Innate thing you know you don't wanna read between the lines too much -- you have to think that the GM is going to be your your point I think Biggio was gonna get five different five. But they're gonna have to hit the reset button in a number of barriers and it's just as a football fair and it's tough to see that team go through that because they were headed in the right direction we were building towards on the positive. Especially at the -- to play them all vote. Patrons want it was a home game here it was still pretty competitive game and lesbian ten points and felt what this team has turned the corner is is a competitive team to division -- and make -- move this year. But there's a poignant pieces out there portrait of of the thing missing is a -- -- left -- tackle. I mean and did you got to protect the dive it's been you know has been -- more than -- -- felt. But beyond that I I'm still not sold on the Jeff our -- thing of the reason I say about. He -- that he's gonna get -- or I don't know and I think that's why they've built up a process play out he certainly looked that much like argue looks bad but that doesn't mean it's real. At the bit we know that our -- was not like prior to us. And all we now know his involvement this process is an accusation of a quote from David Corn ball to me that's. But the weakest piece of their permission and everything in life that you can get these days so you know he said that Ireland said the switch to -- means it may very well not happened so. That's why I think again this this thing needs -- run its life but I guess I begin I'm not terribly educated -- what else is wrong with Jo -- On the map of his involvement is. When did -- only ultimately nobody sat across the table from Dez Bryant that the at OK guys -- had asked him if his mother was a -- will -- vote yes and I mean it. An idea that Obama -- -- -- that OK you know what that's David corporal -- while some one knows he has the ability Cummins solid and all by the way the only time. You've heard anything from players association. About this whole thing was it was win DeMaurice Smith shot at Jeff Ireland you know again not liked and I get that but it whose jobs now. Maybe it would have been -- but I mean if if -- under the garden because of only the new introduced abduction this quote. And -- quotes. -- -- I don't adults if that's enough to have to take him somewhere and as of today I think it's enough because. He is he's developed that reputation in -- -- -- GM of team that struggled a little bit. And I I I also think that. You know owners in in owners are acutely aware of how bear franchise is perceived that the public perception around their team. And I think. People are -- some sort of fall guy and I think Stephen Ross is going to give them to let me let me airfare or not I think we're gonna have satellite OK and then -- probably should have done at the beginning. -- -- -- That in case against in -- need help -- continued to -- this week trying to save face let me get this out of the way and -- will just lay all our cards out on the table. Yes I believe Richie and came up in -- -- wrong and I believe Jonathan Martin's right yes I absolutely truly believe that. By the same token I think it's fairly safe to say that Matt Chatham. Isn't necessarily on Jonathan Martin's side and Ali -- further we are not gonna agree on its. We're gonna in fact probably end up having an argument about it continue to discuss it because. I think -- guy with the track record of being Richie -- you don't get no benefit of the doubt from Asia and amber and David -- knows that about you and not and he's taken advantage but I -- so that's how fortunate enough to allow David Cornwell took -- -- me -- put it this way the the NFL met. Or seven and a half hours with Jonathan Martin on Friday. Partners their friends yep Friday. I met for seven and a half hours they will meet with -- and -- you know at some point -- -- will meet with Joseph Philbin -- -- with Jeff Ireland. I would like to think that the National Football League has its best interest in heart to get this thing right. Him and when the when the National Football League comes out with -- its report on this is what happened this is what didn't happen this is who's wrong this is who's right. I'll see if if my if my opinion is wrong I'll be happy to say I have this one wrong. Richie and cut you know has a track record for me. Jeff Ireland has a track record from me yes I allow those I allowed that track record to steer who -- believer don't believe in this. I'd just rely on the evidence only not -- and they know I mean again it's risen. It's her exactly and when when people make accusations in the absence of much that they and I consult me when we're talking about the first pillar that was put out there was the the trip to Vegas well not just action it's action corrected there's one piece of values in our voice. Again and that is absolutely positively. They are black and white guy because xmas the idea that detect but the idea that was torn from context first tells -- -- -- case is being built here their purposely not wanting to know everything that was going on around there. -- hopeful that we don't get context and that to me is that signal in any court case that would be a signal -- to build the thing that issue aside look past and your gonna. Suppress the stuff that doesn't make your -- looks of the and that's why. You know they pull all the information they think -- help solely the one guy out -- publicly in the -- mom when they walked out of there with him a vote on now now we don't start. And that's why it'll all come -- and I think that's why will then decide but I think this is more just an indictment of the way we. Re litigate things in the media I think the way that we gather information the way that we learn things the way that I think players off what you there hadn't -- you. Litigated against Jonathan Martin in this case capsule -- what how are you know I -- I litigated not to not. Not to trust some of the way the initial you know decided you don't believe Jonathan Martin in this case I've decided I don't believe -- and cut no I I know that's untrue because the first day when that than that voicemail came out I was like holy cow what a lot of people. But then as more things ticked away oh. This guy is doing. At the risk of playing and he -- the -- about this when Richie and kinda neat -- says on an interview with Jay Glazer well you know he says he's gonna kill my whole family. And then the actual text comes out which is one of those still puts total millions without a woman holding the dog woven -- an M by the -- didn't -- and cut nearly half the story up to make his side look better in that case. Again there's 11100 text you don't think the content of that commitment to the Morton look like he's a participant and and and win and win Richie and -- you know told Jay Glazer he said he wanted to kill my whole family and -- incredulous at. He said that he'll just -- about the part or it was up picture of a woman holding a dog with a little I think he's got -- I think -- -- -- -- was guilty of not providing contact with -- -- you talk about giving something in context clearly that was a tongue in cheek response by -- on that singular -- got to we know the other thing is to. We have to hear from -- We have to hear more information from -- has to do more at least in the court of public opinion. In come out from from Ted wells' office in give a two minute statement about what he said and how we did we have to feel like I guess as he was told not to Yemen Libya before before we begin this sort of blanket statement before making extra blanket accusation one -- -- the week after. Find out more for mortal too late for that tournament I mean that's the point you can put the genie back in the bottle but the accusations been made a lot of people have so boxers -- about extortion there's columns about bullying. As Glazer said you're now the face open and media members know that the -- never spoke in the bottle when their proven wrong. Bug Duke Lacrosse case 2.0 it doesn't get put back in until someone that suit so the debt that has been opened up that can of worms is now out there it'll have to be decided later. And in a farmer to Richard cardinal missed plays up that way that he's just a dumb guy with a potty mouth. You getting a litigious too and people don't like the world view that I guess my point would be with what one right but Richie had gone with that. -- -- interview. Was say that in kind yes he threatened me the same way but I don't think he was saying and I felt threatened to set it I knew -- wasn't the same way that -- wouldn't have felt threatened by. But a text that leads with your working now in all the content after it was relative to. Killing you working out guys know that in the communicate that way and that's why I think neither of them to -- when it wasn't the same title I feel threatened as well it's not what he was sent. The only the only addition to this other in the fact that that the meeting has already taken place between -- in the NFL Richie and cog needless filed a grievance. That. Hearing for lack of better term is is scheduled to take place this Thursday this coming Thursday. To decide about him what he's doing is appealing the whole four game suspension for conduct detrimental I think what he wants to do ultimately here. It is push the case forward either release may or -- back on the football team. But either one I'm I'm I wanna be playing football next weekend Peter King is one guy who is Carty said. He thinks there is at least one playoff contender out there would be interested in bringing Richie and -- Went to plan their often I think from a practical perspective I think he's gonna get a job but -- -- that it happens sooner than Jonathan -- and no I will say even if the dolphins cut him loose I think he's going to find a job and I thought it would need to depth look it's. -- public perception. Exactly I think is already so the media member -- wins and not thrive again -- -- -- -- -- I'm not saying it's right -- no I'm not going to -- get out of it but again it's -- it goes back to the point enemy before about owners being acutely aware of how their product is perceived in the marketplace in -- -- Stephen -- knows he has a -- but -- -- -- -- now. In any key would be more inclined to cut him loose as opposed to -- sign him to a -- with renewed. You know outlook I'm not saying it's right -- I got -- practical perspective -- -- -- that's that's what I think that's what's gonna and that's sad and that's the state of things and I don't -- argued that might happen but -- Sox. I mean you look at Brian our lines comment I thought he was probably the most. Prophetic -- this the idea that commute real bullies are the media and I think. I think that's when you talk about -- try to do some some research on this with the stubble in ago loses the supersonic its author of the -- ago world issues that. That are going on in this world and we've been sort of drawn in this conversation talk about the problem football culture. But you know blocker and cultural in the testosterone fueled thing and that's why Romney's problems. The biggest issue in in renewable and stuff going on with kids in middle school or general problems -- suicides and issues like that kids that are being anonymous this very serious issue. Is actually side verbal. One of the biggest and most difficult issues and in the the core issue with -- issues that. Did the disproportionate amount of one person influence you know Daniel person being powerless to deal with not a cyber growing so tough because you can just. Destroy a guy on line without being able to have to respond and I think that's part of what players feel they know they feel like you can run up this -- off. Bury the lead in the bottom column of the larger hard at once says that whatever you're powerless and I think. If this had been. Hedged with allegedly and we -- up for terrorists -- alleged for them we won't -- alleged extort her alleged bully. Then I would be OK with that but because of the cases are made so definitively. And in the event they turn -- wrong oh no harm most well -- file. That's worth that pars at three and I need to put -- minority don't segment but the other recent music -- -- also was his mother which I think is important because. Jonathan -- mother was an attorney and a Smart lady and is an attorney is an attorney yes. The kind of attorney of role in that and she uses workplace -- -- harassment attorney at Toyota. That cannot be buried. Not identify out I was reading through all these columns -- everyone else trying to just simply put this together and seeking information from reporters -- -- were honestly just trying to give all the UNC all played out. That would be different but the most important pieces of content from the front into the story will always be the sky was about the was his job. This guy was not happy here. This guy had just walked out of -- meeting his mother is. Workplace attorney he's hired David Cuomo who's notorious for -- people all things are currently import promising to make a -- -- that but that needs to be -- to be a way to judgment -- that what they're important -- a cup final which -- judgment based on what I've stacked everything on the left side on the right -- think there's much more on the out. That's an old so it's okay to make a judgment all but at what it's not it's not okay to filter the column and be able new parts to try and tell the story. Well we didn't know about the the workplace harassment stop and there is -- Albert what it's very we didn't know Albert what are we didn't find. And and that's what happened that's what you are important point of context that if a guy. You know as much as it sounds like good bit of the Richard card beetle golf course. Again is meant to salty you know it's meant to say it's a character assassination the but it doesn't bring you any closer to finding out of bullying happen in the locker but. Point of fact that the person bring in the case. Was reared by workplace harassment attorney. That's relevant to this particular case -- trying to figure out what's actually going and locker is this radio is the stooges. He's broken warlock from codes for team sports like that you didn't keep track but the sport. We'll take a break when we come back and the other side Gergen talked about head coaching in the NFL hall one guy who's gonna coach. But not the normal fashion. Another guy who never coaches in the normal fashion and proved it again last night this is NFL Sunday at present -- like a -- -- insurance at Penske. They shop so you've saved is -- the plan's -- dot com today.

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