Feb 8, 2013|
Kirk and Alex are holding down the show this week, they talk with Rob Bradford who is already in Fort Myers, they talk about some of Jon Lester's comments to Rob and talk with ESPN's Keith Law about the Red Sox prospects.
Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.
Let's still showed 937 WEEI. -- ultimate episode right now that's right word is. Well ultimately -- -- -- ultimate I don't -- have that openness and also yes I prefer anti -- Smith but I -- -- -- -- Into an ultimate Mets -- season finale -- sweet but for now. Alex -- here in the blizzard joining us from really love. Lovely. We can't -- rob Bradford Hello World. But some analysts polled by all the advertisements and sponsors central Italian pizza -- everyone should be. Very nice people -- place. They're ego so so I guess we're gonna have you spoke to Jon Lester earlier today -- gonna play into the next year after the first break. Anything jump out news -- force here from analysts to spot. -- -- -- thought doors it was about twenty minutes long guys are either very point to stop it was. They're very -- about when about oh where you want to go in terms of its performance and and you are you excited I just mistakenly used the word drug trade is next Poland and he pointed out but it's pretty. Got a pretty good level prior to last year history -- it and I think. I tried to articulate them the next level maybe it's just doing what you had been doing prior to last year. For the next four years to got -- hoping that I think -- everywhere which are not court was correct sides and other America. You'll on that to talk away about ability to contract status about you -- -- be -- sign on. Yeah option years ago to get past security now that security you'd probably to -- end of -- last -- each year was an option year next year and Vietnam and also talked about the trade Gruber with Kansas City in the I was disappointed about that. So yeah I got big good. Because he clearly motivate each ordinary guy anyway it didn't. I guess a chip on the shoulder Libya -- -- way to put it yeah -- I think it that's no different this year. Thirteen million team option coming up next your -- out -- about earlier this week you know he's talking about Agassi -- about that I don't think you ever reached. That level what you consider basic things really close. But he disagrees and seemed like you did earlier this week to. Actually do disagree I think that what he did it in from 2008 to 2011 is under appreciated when you look at the history of the game and I'm talking about you know do your baseball reference search from 1901 on. There are sixteen. There are he was the sixteenth pitcher ever. Ever ever ever. Two record four straight seasons between ages 24 and 27. In which he threw enough innings to qualify for the ERA title and had an ERA plus it was that suggested it is CRA was basically 20% better. Did anyone else year after year after year after year that's what I want in an ace -- once someone who has consistently going to be pitching an all star quality or higher. In that's that's what he was doing and so I think that. I think that he's kind of suffers from a halo effect of maybe Pedro Martinez. When we saw someone who was so otherworldly that it's blown out our standards for what a terrific pitcher is. I mean look Justin Verlander had had a below league average ERA a few years ago when he was I think I. 2627. Sell it happens to a lot of guys I just think that. And for the first this idea that Lester hasn't taken it to the next level I think is a little bit unfair. To what he did manage to accomplish for a number of years Yale. A big difference though guys is that Lester had that he never built upon that year out stuck before you're you're right he's remarkably never meet at least to me. That's appropriate people expect -- just kind of set a high standard. It's stuck to didn't go higher but now he was always that to me he was always kind of one of that one of the best five pitchers in the American League is as far as starters go and I don't know. What level you they're there I mean I guess that there is there's maybe the hall of fame level right that's above that he's a status Cy Young sort of well you had a couple that were -- them close to being a Cy Young or if you look at 2010 when he was. You know nineteen and seven got a couple of yet a couple of bad starts right that ended up which is ERA over right you know in -- like. 3.2 ish area but. You know without like one terrible start here and there he ends up with a sub three ERA. You're talking about a guy would have been a top two top three Cy Young contender we'll cut the money rob is is is -- again that he is a year. Which you had was just say to two years ago he has a year or two more years like that he's talking about a hundred million bucks. Yeah a lot of big -- or the -- basic catapult you because you went -- -- came kind of deal. That's where it's good that happened everywhere with got to jump beyond hey you know what to compete Carla what street journal that you -- RB Gilbert. I think it can't look into the triple words all -- and Alex. Point but things -- -- what what contrast he continues. It is how is going to be few important contract at all well and good how the public didn't -- And if you ATP might pick marquis did you know PGA partners better because it buckled. About anything is exactly what you just out which is. You know what what where to go -- it and turn them into next contract which has writer comical. Yeah although it's not quite right around the corner right until it finishes the season by the time rednecks contractor I must go to. -- as he points out. -- very didn't you -- -- the old error body is basically. That you understand as an option but he also understand that an auction could do it by OP created a certain eagle putt dropped serve. This good in doing this year as tremendously important for a lot of reasons one of the reasons he did mention with the Kuwait into -- yet they're. Kirkuk is -- guaranteed year edited -- audits are. Which we saw with Kevin Youkilis last year to be sure but I mean to me you know as much as I you know I think that I'm on the -- I didn't my biases. Or at least my conviction is that Lester. Had a number of years in which he was kind of an ace caliber pitcher at the same time I'm still not sure that I want to extend them if I'm the Red Sox because I think exact instance of a kind of good that danger zone where they've disbanded I -- John Lackey right trying to avoid you give lesser fields for five years for. Eat your hundred million dollars in his thirties at least five right -- for a -- I mean when does that work. I mean you know I I even think that I even question the Felix Hernandez extension that was just signed granted they just extended him for five years but. You know they already had him for two more years of their Davis could sign -- for. What years 29 to 34 at a record setting contract for a guy who has a ton of mileage on his on his arm. Yeah I was with pitchers the risks are just. You know it's one thing to sign free agent position players free agent pitching is just -- -- that's -- -- a lot of risk. Then everybody get from the red -- point of view is that you you don't need a couple of Jewish guy you can talk about that aren't ruby color good. All these other guys by. -- -- -- crop rotation -- if you are willing to let -- go after the next year so back I would -- -- great article if you feel quite possible that -- well. To optimize your controlled 2070. And controlled around that so that's why I do expect it will probably -- Ryder -- laughter in the -- where. And couldn't and then it opened up again to a bidding war they really like a little bit and a. You know guys that strikes me is that this would be prime opportunity for the Red Sox to at least I'm not saying let's repute. And restart conversations with him -- long term deal they were ever going to do it because he's coming off such a bad year to you reported yesterday. Rob that hasn't happened it that surprises me the Red Sox -- that we started the conversation given you regularly get him for some you know eighty cents on the dollar. Yeah I they don't barbecue like I agree this could secure the -- -- -- -- -- exactly that our Buick and got. But it might be just good understanding pat. -- suited to enter into a conversation. -- Pushed back with you all the numbers that Alex is just magic and a legitimate numbers and if you're coming out -- what those numbers and where those facts. Ben Jaffe kept to a level where there is going to be you know kind of bargain basement got our own content out so you know maybe that's how they think he had maybe that's why they haven't approached. To me I think there are two considerations with that from the Red Sox perspective one is that. You probably wanna make sure that the stuff comes back because he has seen a steady decline fastball velocity in and strike out numbers for the last three seasons so. So you don't take it and take anything for granted you wanna see the guy once again showing that he can you know that he can just dominate as he did for at such a large chunk of his career. And and secondly you know to my mind if -- the Red Sox now spring training is typically when you lay the ground work for a possible extension. Rather than yeah I think that their track record aside from Pedroia and maybe you because it's been. That when they talk contract it's typically not in the offseason but instead when the team gets back together in Fort Myers. Well I would think there so I I I agree that. Tibet to a degree when they do it but you're all expected the people that -- talked into it. Is it like. The red -- -- Pedroia oral or did a lot more. The optimism but it -- a stronger feeling it. They've got a funeral a approach Pedroia but could not brochure about the project deconstructing. Here. What else going on down thereof anything -- And John Farrell talked today. You all to consider -- should be quick tomorrow -- alt a little bit but. -- now he's going to be here tomorrow. And you'd blow up no limitations -- run on a treadmill thing with no problems will not stretch in spring training that we kind of has learned before. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- can be determined by it's it's called -- Are we getting close you are beginning Muir I guess sort of semi panic stage from Red Sox perspective with or teases overreaction I -- around here certainly get over the juice. He's accurate in the gulf -- days of possibility given. Where it was last year people expect me back pretty soon and I are saying opening day maybe maybe not getting closer that sort of thing. Well Ortiz to a darkened theater days it was bought in particular be ready by the PA it's great credit -- helped matters but if you see him webinar did you see him more than around at the end of but -- That you have Avago obviously they'll be concerned because I'm happy he got away there has been progress and he feels. Optimistic and so we're all we just won't know until it's kind of played out it was it. Although I will say you know there was that optimism that there was progress etc. even last year in the fact that we're now. What 910 months removed from the initial -- injury. You know -- that suggested well this might not get kind of one and like this sort this letter issued Tuesday today. Well what are created whether or vehicle value and respect that. But say you are doing -- -- truly thrilled that I was able I'm doing agility drills without pain that I was able to do before at the end of last year. So that's how he viewed it now you're right and it and it's been a long car. And it'd have to be somewhat of a red flag no question about it. And -- could -- on here and YouTube star -- out he kind of what the facts are what are -- demanded. It didn't mention that you didn't minicamp last month or so because of the cold weather all what you -- pay people to restart and he did how much -- mop the only debt. And how important -- -- that all overpaid they become because. Can't help but to us last week now this is going to be something where -- now would probably be an awful lot more time -- -- Our rob -- go to would we get tourists that day you -- right. No I had never -- -- -- are -- going to release city and a darkroom. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I'll tucked away. Thanks we get back it's going to be -- -- sitting down with Jon Lester FROST/NIXON asked him. As ever he has ever does that that's the standard for a thorough journalism on which part of FROST/NIXON series to get points or -- we -- -- to Jon Lester after the break on the hot -- showed that the media. Back on the hot stove WEEI. -- -- and Alex here rob Bradford was -- was the last segment. He's down for Mars back to work but it was great -- segment he sounded just happy in the sun it was it was great stuff there really was -- But earlier today had a chance to talk to Jon Lester players and some spots in the first. Here's Jon Lester talking to rob but the next level rob asked him that sort of we talked about the beginning -- this idea -- Lester. Is not yet made that you don't agree with quite made that -- to sort of that status we thought he might be a couple of people like Michael or Verlander goes. -- and and -- -- degree being the next in line for the Pedro for the kind of like Pedro as showing a level of you know transcendent figures so -- best Lester bout that here's users. It's -- I don't know I don't know just understand is. Take last year Sodom and fifteen more games for four straight years there's only the pictures that did that so what next level is there. That's the thing that frustrates me is people don't consider me and -- don't consider me -- Frontline starter -- when there's two other pitchers in all of baseball but did that. What am I. Oh that that's my argument to. What extra level is it possible to win 25 games every year. I'm really. Not possible. You know because wins. Are not in my. Enough. Mean you look at last year on the quality starts. Coming games that lose well went eating you after Angeles. So. I can't control the outcome of the game -- can only control. Being healthy every five days ago there it and that's what I consider its. Is I don't -- yours. The number five guys opening day guard somebody in between if you take every five days and you it did you bust your. To me in my mind that's an. So. The next level I don't know the next level I don't know what people. From the from the next well. So I've come to realize you know what I'm not concerned about an -- I'm not concerned about what people from me I'm concerned with what I've done. The past sixty years is take the ball every five days take pride in that bust my -- between him he'd start. Its 200 innings. That's all -- can control. You know jumps out at me Alex a couple things first of all -- multiple ways. Quickly mentions one for 415 wins for -- but that's as you know when they -- neutral and spread you wanted to do it because of that we did say I can't control wins. Yeah although again the problem is that -- the content his. I think that. It's has he is one of the only three guys for those four years who had fifteen plus wins in an ERA of 3.5 or below and obviously the RA. Is in many ways a more important number in a more revealing ones wins the time during those years him CC and Roy Halladay. Were the only three guys in the majors to have that kind of consistency. Of winning with hello we RA I get over I 20082 legged. This idea from Lester these almost like. We're expecting to go 235 with euphoria -- -- I mean yes some people would expect that that's what people thought. You were -- couple years ago a graduating. That kind of year that is the reason I think it's a people's eyes for discipline because you've been great he's never had the kind of his best is not in Verlander is best is not sure that's not open. Yes I'll write it and that is to your point right he hasn't he hasn't won -- Cy -- -- and -- the year when he's been the best pitcher in baseball. He's been kind of among the best pitchers in baseball. And I do think that there was this sense state because of his -- because of his dominance because of his stuff. Did he was capable of you know of being of of the Verlander to have season and the funny thing as -- you know he could view that as a compliment rightly. The fact that people think that these kids doctors and I've really do anything to stuff. You know during those during those four years was as good as any mountain in the world. So the fact it does so he views it as as being dismissive of what he accomplished and there's some truth to that I do think that again. If you look at it across history you know it's kind of it was a kind of hall of fame caliber. Age 24 to 27 run. But at the same time you know that consistency was that was viewed as not being sufficient based on the fact that the peak. Wasn't that of you know the kind of transcendent Cy Young guy and I do think to be sensitive about that because I do think. As he wants to defend his record clearly he's sensitive about it. QB guy in line here a year ago two years ago for one of those major you know. Enormous eighties maybe now we just suffered juice bananas but he's come through an option year Red Sox team option thirteen million dollars and the potential contract coming up. It's on the talk -- again you're likely brought earlier today I mean and. You know even option so far away and now it's next year and it's an option you don't know you know obviously if -- -- -- have a good year. 99%. And -- Have an -- year. Don't know you know there's there's there's that unknown of stability where we can be what we can do -- -- you know that -- -- a lot of people don't have to deal with. Lot of people do and just like you said the nature of the beast and it is what it is and and this of prime realized how much talk about it and move. It's an -- ought to do I can't worry about that. Because if I -- do my job this stuff take care of itself I don't in my job that's win. You the second questions in the OK what about this. You know with a -- and it is what it is you know you'd have to cross that bridge when when it comes in. That's how much try to do is pitch and prospers when it comes. So I mean it's hard for me to believe well short of falling off a cliff like. Them put another way. It's Lester has a year this year which he had last year -- and pick up there. I think as long as he's healthy health is the extent of it yes. Yeah I mean look they just gave thirteen billion dollars a year exact to Ryan Dempster -- you know and the market for Edwin Jackson was -- I was thirteen million dollars a year guy like an animal Sanchez. It's five years and 75 so yeah -- -- If he's healthy. Then based on the -- -- I think Dan Haren coming off an injured season. Actually just got -- when you're -- million here's Rick it's interesting to me Lester this year. Eighteen and 8331. Point one you know strike -- go up a little bit then -- -- That's the interesting one because the guys who have had extensions are at his kind of with with tech -- -- performance track record have typically been more than a year out from free agency right so they've been you know Felix Hernandez who we were just talking about a little bit earlier. I'm just signed a five year extension with two full seasons left on his contract. And that was what you know that that was like. 2728. Million dollars a year on those. And those extension years. So that's what it starts to become. A little bit tricky because there was this one class of like of second extension second long term extensions where. You look to guys getting five years and in the vicinity of 8590 million dollars -- needing cap Lester had you know a great year in 2013. Proved it 2012 was the aberration of course the Red Sox would be comfortable going to. You know going to like maybe nineteen inch twenty ish million dollars a year five years. For those five years. But then you get into the question of well what if it's 25 verify if he's proven that I second -- -- outside picnic in the -- I just think they're not gonna give this guy 85900. Million dollars if they're being truthful. About their philosophy. I don't -- it really knock on -- I just I don't see. Another way of looking at this is look at the predicament that signing Josh Beckett resigning Josh Beckett got them -- because you know he was. He had been really really good in in 2009. At the beginning of 2010 they say okay. Even though you're a year out from free agency -- an attack on for years to snag him in April or early Saturday April right yeah of it was a luxury tax thing to witness obviously yeah I was basically with a year left on his contract. Four years right sixty -- victorious. Yes 68 million bucks. Ends that ended up and so in the year when in in the year that was his quote unquote locked year that ended up dropping as -- -- he was dreadful. He would have to have cost them a lot less -- -- Had they waited until after the season. And then and then he was actually very good people you know and should remember for those for -- iPhone -- 2011. Before it went off the rails at the end of it men last year. Boy that contract looks terrible the last three years of that contract. -- his shoulder clearly having lost strength his fastball velocity diminishing you know that's is that what you would be looking out with Jon Lester if you were to extend him and it's a tough one because the red socks love his make up the red socks love his you know his commitment to his work ethic. Things that we heard about Beckett as well of course. Lester would be younger than Beckett was -- he would have fewer and fewer innings I think logged on his career but. You know it's still any time you're talking about a pitcher in his thirties. To sign him to five years not there's there's a huge risk now no matter who it is if -- And he goes somewhere -- five years is great good -- I would do it rob next talk to Lester here this is interesting and I haven't heard talk too much focus in the off -- now who's that. That -- footer -- Myers with Kansas City. The rays ended up ended up -- achieving with them in getting its huge prospector turned in addition to Myers also getting -- you know -- well regarded pitcher or another person was -- and so rob passed Muster both the trade rumors the offseason we felt about that. You know I've got. After last year you know he yeah he did it need people try to buy low. You know they figured. Well maybe you know he's down years they can. -- wanna get rid of them and try to. Maybe try to rebuild somewhere and then back into the prospects. It is what it is his business. I don't. Whole thing here and I'll hold anything against you know ownership or anything like its business I understand. You know something that obviously. You need and he used to you know it's it's different when your name out there for the first time and oh man this could be possible for them cross the line. So I mean it's it's different but it says in its business and pain and walk out your house retreat. I mean it. It's the nature of what we do. It's and stability of what we do. You know you don't see that guys. It -- call -- careers anymore it's just. It's it doesn't happen as much as it used to and that's. That's oh thanks all and and he's listed earlier except that. I think the better off York regardless of schedule and now. How much since Wednesday. Watching route it's it's nature's what we do and that's. Deceptive -- -- quickly realized that these here comes when things like last year this offseason come. Simple test you first test but it seemed like he was something he didn't really want to talk on anyone talking about it but I mean I think these overall message -- he got around to it. Is true it was in this Izzy is in the Red Sox are trying to get go get a guy he's also right I think. I'm sure teams looked at it and said you know it's a good chance to get this guy 10. So yeah Mecca at the -- was located the other spots with a crazy open I mean I -- series comes from -- Couple things one is that the Red Sox were in a different position this year than they were ever before because. In the past they never would have discussed Jon -- at least in the last few years but because of the season they were coming off of for the first time they were really in position to actually listen on anyone on their roster rather than saying this the cornerstone player who we must keep. The second thing is. Lester is always had a very level head regarding trade rumors about him because he's actually been traded for I mean he was going to go to the Rangers for Alex Rodriguez along with Manny Ramirez. And he's very cognizant of that. Over the years he's brought it up you know he's brought it up in casual conversation always a different guys on different guy now that he wasn't sure but he's he was convinced that he was gone then he was convinced it was gone one other time in his career I think. When the yellow on rumors the on Santana rumors I got sprung up after the 2007 season he was convinced yet they're gonna deal for -- -- and I'm a Minnesota twin. So he's not he's already kind of reconcile that his his. Himself to that even though he's also said when in in saying that that's the business part of the game that he really wants to finish his career as a Red Sox. Interesting this year with blustery comes -- as a guy. Coming off he really bad year for the first time now last year he came in. With different before dot com for other reasons he finished badly but didn't have a bad year but -- and finishing given the whole stuff arsenal fall people felt differently about him. And -- -- before we saw coming off a year we presume. He was still the guy that from news this year is different. And rob asked about that lesser expand on the. On those votes that first month this offseason was tough. You know usually. If you spend the couple days here and there by myself whether it's. You know doubt farmer. You know just. Doing errands or whatever and I kind of reflect on things and think about the the season think thinks about how things went. But it seems like it is took me you know a lot longer than that -- me couple weeks to come out. Filter through. Everything. So you know I think you could really throw any and every one of those words. Into. You know my off season and into the spring training in. Into into my season and you know ready to. You know I've never been. I've never been on the side I've never had to prove myself. So. Using that as motivation. To go out. For him to myself that I am who I am. It's -- on the guy and I do think that you know for the first time this last stretch but it's something to prove to name maybe he doesn't think that but this year he's a guy who you are looking at saying. Will it mean for a year he's been bad now he said you know I was bad one month that was grip and hit a bad you should know. Yeah he was he had pretty good stuff and stretches out right it's worth pointing out as well I do think that there were. You know if you were to take out this 13 start segment of -- season. Where his mechanics for just. Dreadful I mean god awful he basically was sticking his first in his foot into the first base dugout on -- delivery. His his season has his numbers would look drastically different his ERA would have been about three quarters of -- -- lower. And then you're talking about a guy who went like. Nine and eleven with about a four point one ERA -- -- was evidence there is entitled nobody ever says notes take those three starts to get out alive -- this type of matter is even without those three starts you know his season would have been decent it still wouldn't like our policy. Right rate without such a writes I think he looks at it now is a year. And eggs were Ferrell made very well play a factor this is a year. For him to bounce back this financial reasons now this -- reasons the fans and don't feel the same way as -- as they did a couple of years ago. You know he's one of these guys and I think if you don't want them up 12 whatever. There's no way can happen any worse than in the second or third most important member of this team. He can absolutely be -- best player on the team basically he can be the most valuable member of the Red Sox. But if you falls short of that you know if he if he repeats what he was last year in the gap between what he can be in what he is as we saw in 2012. Is so significant that it creates a real obstacle for the Red Sox if they wanna be really good teams so. I I agree central central player essential contributor and he knows it too and he cares about it. Which I do think from a makeup standpoint that's why the Red Sox love him because he embraces that he's not going to hide from it he wants to garden in his own words kickass. I've break we come back ESPN's. Keith law talks about the -- organizational rankings Seattle where the Red Sox rank in the whole Major League minor league. System as that sounded great now I know is trying to say. Where the Red Sox rank among all thirty farm systems and -- should be why my host -- they actually host minor -- -- I am to my experiences Kirk Keith why ESPN joints after a break and that's. Joining us now in the AT&T hotline is Keith -- for BSP and Keith are you did. Go get a piece earlier this week ranking the organization's farm system won thirty of the Red Sox number seventeen I guess my question -- be a drive that conclusion. So to do that you like it's it's part of the package were in the top 100 prospects in baseball into the top ten. For each organization. And. You -- organizational rankings now looking much deeper than. I'm looking and really anybody in their system -- think projected. Is having some kind of significant mutually role. Even if it's just the back up fourth outfielder quality reliever. And. And weighing the upside you'll what's the best case scenario for all these prospecting each of the systems and then also considering. Proximity how close are these guys to actually contributing to protect not just actually getting here. But it being in the majors in and contribute some positive value to the Major League club and like to protect have a decent farm system I think that the last two draft. Have helped significantly in -- system that was really kind of on the downswing prior to that I don't think they a lot of impact it's close to the majors. But it is kind of high upside pitching I think they have more kind of back and. Pitching quality relief prospect but not a lot of the potential number one and two starters that other organizations have where. It may not all they're not gonna alternative aces or virtues but at least the possibility exists that. As you know keep. With the way the Red Sox -- sort of selling this is and I can make any big deals -- -- assigned as for a couple of years and bank largely. On this farm system giving your results -- which you found with a -- reason. Your Red Sox Spaniard to panic when you look at this now you're saying this is not one of the top half in baseball's Marxist. I wouldn't panic but I would definitely. If I were asking the Red Sox directly about the feds say well what you plan to do in the next say twelve months. To -- to improve the ranking to improve the gap. In the system and to try to bring in at least a couple war. High upside guys to -- in your ball courts is the 19 sister might look and I think that the spark that guy is getting extremely high likelihood determine if you. Well above average everyday player in the majors that it your top ten pick in the draft which they haven't haven't forever. And that's a huge opportunity for them to try to get another player like that because typically in the draft those guys off the board in the first 1015 text. The Red Sox -- -- after the. So picking believe it's beef overall this year. There have been -- this year even better they've got that opportunity then to go out again but a guy like that it might be high school player which. I think he's probably not ideal for them but it's not agree -- for position players it's not a great draft for college back. The best player available may be high school player and I don't think they know yet what direction they'd like to go and but at best player available could turn out to be something that's just not traditional for them what their first off topic. So one thing that -- interest in you said that you don't see a lot of kind of top of the rotation sealing him in the Red Sox system at least you know in terms of in terms of likelihood of a projection. I think one of your more interest in evaluations was that of of Matt Barnes because. You know I know that you don't consult other ranking systems but he's someone who was viewed. As being relatively. Easy to project number three by a lot of but by a lot of people both. You know publications as well as scouts. -- with -- you know in some -- -- kind of a a likely three potential for number two I assume that you view him a little bit differently. That gap certainly less -- I don't I don't think that's that's reasonable. Evaluation of where appliances. Today and I you know I give him credit for four making I think a lot of progress. Since getting out of school where he his junior year UConn was a little bit disappointing allowed the attack against him. Where they didn't think I could have gone in the top ten or at least top fifteen. Going into spring in just kind of without the gamut messing around with a slider that was. Go out garbage pitched four and that he has done and now he's back to fastball curveball changeup. Which is gonna be more effective for him than that that's why it was just kind of a waste of everybody's time. Now the big thing with sports is that. I don't strikeout numbers were great he's doing a lot of it is with great fastball command -- -- he loved to see that. But it's not like he has knock out stuff. And I think as he continues to move up the latter unless one of those pitches takes a big -- sport like suddenly the curve ball. Ethically or two you know in terms on the twenty to eighty scale. Yeah he's probably going to be relying on that fastball command to continue in this bats and that's harder and harder to do was to move up the latter day you can certainly help yourself with that. -- You your boarding colossal mistakes and yours that you walk. Hopefully allowing him to keep the ball park is that kind of like on the fastball. It to be there to help. But that's not typically you end up. In the top spot in the rotation most guys you can the pitch up there have one page that either clear Sweden has pitched or something that just generates tons of ground balls. And -- for me doesn't have any and I will felt like gamma rays have a little bit because it's not a great delivery he's got the size -- repeats that the arm action. Fine but it's not the clean mr. gonna come across and that does give him -- -- slightly higher risk for injury that some of the other pitchers have rated higher. So getting back to Kirk's earlier question about as you can kind of the Red Sox perspective of team building. Do you see as impact prospects -- guys with a chance to come up and help that the Major League level in either Tony thirteen or 2014. I think that the two closest for me art Jackie Bradley junior -- the publicly defense in the majors right now sure. In Arabic bets that far off I don't think he's gonna come up and B superstar. He's gonna be high on base -- and which is great actually approach has really improved. The last twelve months -- We've got to have a kind of power he can play every gains that are probably be an above average regular at his peak because he's got a great defense of skills good range good -- Just a cover up. More instinctive baseball player. We'll get on -- at a good clip he could probably do that. At some point 2014 maybe start the on the roster then let Ellsbury walked and just -- Bradley cut more into the role over the course of the year. I think Alan Webster could help the big league club at some point this year it is issue would be if you gave him Matt -- commit them pretty damn good pitcher right there. Ray you've got he could think -- like your ground ball he's got a good breaking ball he -- -- -- He has always had issues with fastball command and it would control studio like control that you people like to start strikes. And that and can kind of developed a little slowly. Went to the converted shortstop he hasn't actually been pitching for that long and I think I and I -- fall for the -- to -- it look at what's become -- expect him to make that. Move in in command and control. Because eventually. If you don't throw enough strikes you can't throw quality strikes at the -- what you do end up in the bullpen. Did they may choose to use in the bullpen at some point -- -- this year anyway they don't have a spot in the rotation but he's going well enough for the fighters. Could come up the DF 36 out kind of middle innings for them in August and September yeah I. I think he'd actually -- an apple producing. He thought ESP -- -- ski do you get the sense talking to people our guest just observing your own. Have been charged and is the right guy plea disorganization specific guest in that aspect of it comes to. Farm system given is to get his history. Well if that's his background right that he oversaw the art system over several years since. He's extremely well respected around the game he's seen as a good leader he's seen -- very thoughtful. It's very intelligent as the guy who could carry forward a lot of the philosophies that were in place at the previous regime. So I mean I haven't really heard any criticism of him directly depends some criticism. Of the -- there's a lot of confusion as to why it had our share. Are suddenly trying to play in the middle pure free agents to think historically the most dangerous area play the premium guys. You know I'm cigarette tax cut troubled air but in general if you go after the start he'd do fine and she go into the kind of bargaining began. You can do pretty well the the middle peered into victory ideal for me was the worst free agent contract in the off season. And Napoli obviously they redid the deal but there's no way of getting. The years the guy he is basically a part time captured -- probably just a fulltime DH. Those are not the players that there really any I would recommend any team beside me but it seems like their strategy is that is that the class of free agents. We wanna go after at least for the next couple of years. And I wanna put that on any one particular person in the front office but just. Don't really understand that as a philosophy because of the history of that collective free agents is not that good. I'm I'm curious about your your view of a couple of guys who have graduated technically from prospect status and so weren't eligible. But in terms of potential impact on the 2013 team. How do you -- guys like. How do you how do you view ruby tiller roast. And coming up for Tommy John surgery but with obviously electric stuff -- the hard way who had a great track record up until last year when. When that when the offensive numbers went down. And and a guy like to -- who was spectacular in the major leagues last year but you know is it it's a reliever so you know there's a sustainability question. To a Baylor -- us that means -- looked like a potentially before he got hurt I was getting calls that sporting. March spring training and then in April 2 -- out to -- income -- the the best I've seen all year. -- pitching with -- -- fastball you know plus change up it was very easy strikes strikes command wasn't really there and then you know three months later the -- After we haven't really seen him all the way back at this point so. Do like the pinkie could be adding that the potential spill there it seems like the -- -- doctors the ability to throw that -- is still in the arm. I don't know how much more time it's gonna take for him just to get back. Command wise spiel wise secondary to -- he was before the surgery so I wouldn't tell you I think illnesses in the rotation all year this year. And he's effective I think eventually gets back to that point but don't be surprised to come out the first to have this season he's erratic. Because he's still trying to get back to where he was. To -- what seems like it sounds as well eleven bear attack but he could be back and starter originally really struggled -- that role. That he could morph back into the app but it looked like -- got so much success within our role it was don't want certain that he be more than. Maybe a fourth starter is it even act. I don't think there's -- -- of reasons to move him out of that spot. Well mark -- and he could actually be really good big leaguer that he's. A back up back there and in which you've got this. Kind of out of regular DH was offense just doesn't really profile. As even an average designated hitter in the will give what the standard is the American right now so he's kind of bench player. Who's gonna struggle to find a lot of playing time because teams carry twelve sometimes thirteen pitchers now. Players like -- the army fit better on -- is 1015 years ago than they did today. Final question here Keith for me is the real quickly sort of give us an idea where the other teams the American League east rank we have them ranked the sort of you know among your your top thirty of the Yankees and Orioles. Rays and blue jays. The rays are third overall they are clearly the class of the division in terms of their minor league system and have to be like that not be able -- -- the Major League level to be able to replenish. From within character traits and part of what boosted them to it was. Picking up -- Meyers -- arteries via Mike Montgomery in the James Shields trade it would've been a couple spots -- in the rankings. And get the big east have been -- the Orioles thirteen. If it's minor differences to a beat the Yankees a better system attacks -- absolutely. Are they world better now they're kind of -- in that same general territory. It you don't have a lot of -- term impact either but the do have a group of position players. Moving gradually up the system off fairly young. I think they could end up with two maybe -- re above average or better regulars from back crop the blue jays basically gave the formal way they got I think laughter. They're clearly the bottom of the division except one guy who's been a favorite of mine if you in high school senior and Sanchez. Tremendous odd chance for three plus pages. Need to throw more strikes he's only twenty you'll be high AA there's almost no near term impact. From bear arms systems of the blue -- they kind of the I I actually wrote that you know. And copilot with GM it's kind of push -- justice center of the table stood up they are all in at this point. And the worry about rebuilding the farm system after the next take two years or so they want to try to win. I'll -- we appreciate your time you and you should know this you join John Ferrell as the only three time guests on the hot stove show so. Right yeah I think that's the do I get like a hand -- like. It's it's the Triple Crown it's just. 23 Richard that was the most appropriate and yet to come to grips with the fact is the first line Euro. There's really no doubt about. My. Thanks electors but let's keep lobbyists into joining us on the hot -- show. Quick break we'll be back. Final minutes of the hot stove show here on a WEEI out spear Kirkland and takeaways from the people spot. Well I do think that it's really interesting because we've heard so much this off season. Up from a number of publications and from the Red Sox themselves that they feel great about the shape. Of their farm system and its potential big league impact in the near future obviously key to you know keep approaches things. From the ease he he keeps his own counsel. And NT has a different view of the Red Sox farm system in terms of its. Short and medium term impact to mean the real question is how much impact are they going to get from 2013 and 2014. Look the Red Sox aren't under allusions that. They're going to have the -- Zander Bogart's in Jackie Bradley junior and price Branson Alan Webster and ruby Doris are all going to make seamless transitions to the big leagues. But their hope is that by having this volume of really interesting prospects that they're going to get some contributors were able to make an impact. In the next season or two. If if it takes a little bit longer than that then. You know it does become a little bit of in what does that become a consultant processes -- what is it bleed into concern territory that I mean here's a year from now. I don't think fit 213 I think they're they are built for 2013 to be you know to let these guys develop at their own cases starting in 2014 it becomes more important for them to start progressing to via its Major League level Stephen Drew is on the sign for -- years so shortstop as a question after that -- on how ugly -- Moves they might -- Bogart's there certainly Ellsbury sells very Jackie Bradley you know of Jackie Bradley junior gets injured or if he doesn't develop you know if he doesn't follow this great. Smooth the development path that he's been on. In -- doubling and triple -- this year than that could be that could be an issue for them. So and I think that they don't they don't exactly have a long term answer in the court in not in both corners of the needs someone like. A price brands or may be a Bryan English to get healthy and get better. They could use all of our way to get you know to get in position to challenge -- assessment and so I think what fourteen is when. They really need to see some of these guys starting to make an impact even though they're -- and all of them I don't. He said he does this independently -- But from people you talk to which you look at it is. It's not -- a ramming this is kind of where most people have them ranked right now organizationally you know he he knows about fire BI in the higher than most people he has them he has the way lower than most people baseball America I think has them as -- top five farm system right but they they have. What is considered certainly their best crop of prospects in years and years. And depending on how you look at -- I mean. You know -- -- -- Bogart's ranked as a top five prospects nominally baseball Jackie Bradley junior stooges everyday center fielder in the next year plus. You know you have it five miles 100 right as they have for the -- Ford keeps top 100 other people have something like six Red Sox prospects. In the top 100 so it's a kind of eye of the beholder thing but he's he's definitely more conservative less bullish on their farm system. And others but there's you know but his opinion as you know. Is is well formed so the fact there's variation as a reminder that there is unpredictability here in the fact that you know a lot of people think the Red Sox farm system could be really did. Doesn't mean it certainly will be right up there we thank Keith law and Jon Lester for joining us Alex next week is the season finale about -- optional. On Valentine's Day what better way in order -- what better way we'll what now my question is what twisters or who's gonna die. We're going to be pregnant what's gonna happen is what intrigue Alice entry is gonna happen in the season finale. Of the hot social Bradford Spearman hand who makes. About it. Yeah it's it's like an episode of survivor I think we all have to eat like insects in order to find out. Iowa thanks Alex and our rob down in Florida and Jon Lester says said Keith law would back next week -- social planet Mikey coming up next on WB yeah.