Jan 24, 2013|
This week on the show, Kirk, Rob and Alex talk about Mike Napoli's defensive abilities at first base and how the Red Sox might manage his playing time. They also talk about Terry Francona's book which details his time with the Red Sox and how it reflects upon the organization. They also talk about some of the Red Sox other signings, such as Stephen Drew.
Transcript - Not for consumer use. Robot overlords only. Will not be accurate.
-- off as we head into. So which pretty -- the Celtics game with -- Max Celtics knicks big game for them. Tell that it's baseball we're gonna take some calls here tonight -- agreement be scheduled yet is -- so. -- and interaction six point 77797937. Is that number guys what's going on. Well we just go back over from the baseball writers' dinner media availability and that was electric. -- Johnny Jones Daniel Nava Andrew Miller. Terry Francona joke and publish this I guess I don't. 175. Dollars and well up there. There is that's at 75 bucks and negotiate Jonny Gomes Andrew Miller. And Tito may be maybe Pedro regular public -- -- -- talk you. And there is an autograph signing session that recruited mad dog that's that is included -- -- in the in the price -- Kansas State dinner. -- -- -- and you're used to door and smoked cigars this. What anything noteworthy on newsworthy coming out nominee reduce. RAI the Pedro stuff he's always interesting -- -- use this on the big show right John Farrell use Kerry gave -- -- and what's going on which is. He's making kind of the rounds of a lot of players and all over the place looking at these guys and doctrinal Tom talked -- little bit we have the sound -- this suggest. Him talking about Napoli and -- him playing at first base which is. No this was referenced in news conference call by. That Napoli when he gets to spring training it's doctor W -- K here's the -- judgment is going to be here's the first baseman glove and don't think about it now are. You'll start I guess is -- apple because you know in the last week they signed him -- -- learn it is -- dying which we didn't know -- week ago. His hips are rotting away and he just starting first baseman -- the Boston Red Sox is that about right. The Astaro Farrell did say that there is no when he went to see him there's no symptoms is nothing that you could tell by. But that doesn't mean anything you can get how how is discovered guy gonna react in June July August September and beyond well we. Tell you said he talked to Ferrell are asked about the theories. We've got some -- at caves which. No restrictions Slorc extremely -- driving the ball best stage work. -- just eliminate the impact on the pound. Defensive. Yeah of course yeah. I mean I you have to say okay 39 million OK did work out fine. To -- here for the Red Sox it's five million dollars I understand so. This is that guys can be your first that's the five million dollars doesn't make difference at this point why they pay him 500 don't know policy but deploy is the discussion is should be right now. Is can this guy produced in beat the -- -- first thing I think is obviously legitimate fear you're getting from. Five million for year there's a reason why sure absolutely I mean obviously it's incentive -- but the Red Sox are insulating themselves from the possibility. Of him playing not at all which neither party X expects. They both seemed to expected LB in all likelihood all right and when he thirteen because he isn't showing symptoms my -- by saying here's the thing behalf they insulating themselves. And if something happens in terms a contractual. By it and we all think they're gonna get another first baseman here weathered a Kotchman whether it's over -- whatever. -- How important is Mike Napoli to the middle disorder it I think that's where -- they don't really have an -- it is and especially with. You have to say well what's -- Ortiz is gonna show up in terms it is his heart was a potentially and I think that makes these two guys -- are meant to me are tremendously -- that's right that's the thing out -- -- -- -- bring in overpay but if -- to -- -- stinks I mean you're going to be here and he patrol. I I get what you're saying I think that's an exaggeration of of overbay is abilities since. He was actually quite good up until he got injured and all it hits two home runs a year right out so -- -- today's I don't know if you look at is that if you look at the if you look at the game logs from last year -- hitting quite well up until he got injured mid July. But now I mean you're right look it's not the middle of the order. Guy who they envisioned to -- circled Mike Napoli as being their answer and really when you remove Napoli so if you do removed Napoli. And let's -- you have an alternate who's a league average first baseman. No nothing exceptional. Then who Wear LC getting back kind of that kind of hitter may be that can be middle Brooks but you don't know. Maybe that can be -- buried but you don't know. And so there there is a lot of uncertainty there in terms of the overall -- lineup because in the past let's -- in 2011 if they had to. Kevin Youkilis go down they still had David Ortiz and Ernie Gonzales and a lot of guys. Inaudible could deliver some pop and that's not -- here's here's the question -- and oh by the way over -- -- 397 last year 360 again you're you're looking every like there was like it's pretty 25 after he was -- but can he was released making exciting is flattered to hear directly push if you could just -- I am not saying his -- Arab saying that he's a pretty decent hitter Lou Gehrig now Serena got me right now. There but what why what happened year after after it fell through initially. There's that was or any. Why would nobody else jump in the middle that happens the team. Well am -- reasonable evidently the Texas Rangers were willing to offer more money Barbara guarantee mortgage guarantee I was so. At that point in the offseason looked like he you have some news Seattle get some players. Among the teams who might have to me contrast were already feel in this spots but. To go back to what you have a Napoli. There is a reason. There was it was pretty understandable why they would target discount we've set a time and time again how is a rare player -- guy who takes many pitches is Kevin Youkilis. Who hates it would as much power per plate appearances almost anyone. And so that's why they got up by. But that's why they also had the prioritize them because they need a player like that and if you take tomorrow. Whether -- Lyle Overbay witness it Casey Kotchman all of a sudden to your point now it's you're going to be leaning on you know chameleon like Kevin Youkilis who are going to be leading on J. D. Drew wherever they have in the past. You'll be leaving on will -- Brooks who. To be honest you shouldn't be leaning on him at this. Point in his career right there may come a point where you can lean on him but again you know adjustment of the league second time around etc. right. It's it's interesting. It is interesting frank actually some -- you'd -- give the audio saarc which on the spot of -- and talking about. Napoli today can you find that the -- and over the next minute thanks. When you look at when you look at Napoli here and I guess you know. Again it's -- five which does matter of its five million bucks for a year I it's a risk worth taking over. His eyes are evident that I think it's a good college or else you could dispute uterus on that that it's two different arguments that part matters absolutely but. The other part is what you -- and do if you think that this team can contend in your hoping that they're gonna. Do something this year have -- nobody but nobody else surely you know I mean there's a reason why go out that the organization to add an. Yeah well we knew we could talk about saving it -- a midnight oh we've talked about this before about why the dog trade for Julian what they do. Because they feel like -- you that the placate certain people because this party don't you don't spend you know you don't plus seven million dollars on a closer in order to -- when you're telling -- -- -- -- might as. It's okay well offseason what now. The money matter well welcome to tell if she does her -- because -- -- money doesn't matter at thirty ninth to 39 they don't go to Joseph ball players they want in the same way that the you don't tell a player that you just don't get it. -- if if you don't know if we -- Napoli with. With with Dempster doesn't matter now match no doubt they have money to spend on the players that they want what I'm saying -- told you all offseason -- that. Is that the the idea of those guys being thirteen million dollar players is. You know with the within their arena with. In their view. By virtue of the holes that they address their team they're valuable as such when you require close -- like Joel Hanrahan. You declared that those sixty innings are valuable enough difference making enough that you're willing even one that's not an obvious area of need. The right there's a marginal upgrade annual and spent seven million dollars to address it. I enter into fine if you know this perfectly legitimate conversation -- had an opinion be -- -- this team is knocked in content. This so nobody thinks it can go wrong. -- The fact is is that. The Red Sox are going into this thinking that they at least have a chance -- dynamic of the wildcard. Because of all the things that you know we we've already talked about so let's go back to the original argument which was Mike Napoli. Why is he important this team well you know what. If he does not produce if he's not there that you have a fuel than usual -- I think this is the problem with this team. Is that there -- so little room for error. They've given Napoli who is an injury history if he gets hurt middle Brooks what is his back -- plan Ortiz Ortiz Roy right there ever goes right short you've -- to contend but there's also so many things he. Can go wrong and that's part of the problem I think out and you look at it is is that you know that's the thing I mean like you said. Two years ago three years ago it's different if Pedroia -- forty games if Napoli is hurt. This is a team it's not gonna go from 94 wins to 91 answer 89 Wednesday the winds are gonna go from 83 when the 79 I think it's just different world. Again I think that the parameters that you're setting up of 79 to 83. That's that's your interpretation of it -- -- -- -- -- -- -- gonna win this year everything goes right. If everything goes right -- within reason. I mean I I think that the with the range that ice the honestly for them is anywhere between I would say 81 and 93 to 94. I think if they have if they have guys. Being healthy. And you know and performing essentially to. Career norms with media a couple of guys outperforming those were in their primes. You know the so called something going rights bright Dana I think Rivera ninety plus win team they could get into the into the low ninety's and surprise people because. If you look at the shape of their roster the number of players who were average to above average on their roster. There's a lot of I mean I realized it like that that's not a very high standard -- But when you have a ton of guys were average to slightly above average even with a couple of Al liars who were all star to MVP type caliber guys. Then you have a really damn good team if you don't have. Obvious glaring holes so in the everything goes right scenario there -- play well and. Is the thing that I kept saying last year is there ever was or what's the problem why aren't they doing well you know you look at the top ten guys in terms of payroll and what they were producing. Eight and a half -- you get to August and eight and half -- -- Where basically not doing what you expected them to do what you're being your paid them to do. I think in this case you need to top that the top five or top 56 guys to really really begin. The guys who. Who are just hey you know what we get a -- on you and if they are good that they don't have a chance in this comes back to -- not a lot of room for carrier not nearly as much has been. What -- -- the candidates want talked about offseason talk about all spring training starts at those two guys obviously Lester buckles they have to be good music or one bad year on his bad -- -- -- trouble. But you're right it trickles down apple has to -- Ortiz has to -- -- -- has to be healthy in the bullpen has to be as good as we think it's going to be. And and I think you're in the mix but I think every single one of those things as the above all the Pope. Kinda the bullpen is the one area this team I think they have a little bit leeway. Where they can get guys some guys can have down years make it might be able fill in with the other again as a group -- I've read that but that is basically it because you mentioned western balk calls I mean I think that. Those are top of the rotation got those are the guys are leading on to be top of the rotation guys. You don't slumped killers disguise who you know you feel like you start opening day or -- kill losing streak. And Lackey can give you innings -- can give you innings viewed abroad is we don't know really know what he is yet but I those of the two guys have to step up. Anyways maybe not valued. Defense at first base enough over -- -- acting yeah I think you know there's a real possibility we're gonna find out why here. This year with -- to get something you know you just. I'll think about it much and it -- a pretty good first base and obviously defensively here by and large for the last dictators and they have Napoli who. You know not a good defensive player who's gonna go over to first base he's got some injuries and that's the kind of thing where you don't think about it but the cost of some games. -- the lead the place where I learned that lesson was with John Olerud who went back to back years was with the Mets -- in the -- on teams that basically set records for -- -- fewest unearned runs in Major League history are they about if they were. They were both back to back. He he helped to transform them into week run prevention teams because he had that like twelve foot wingspan or whatever that was ridiculous. And I agree I think that there is problem that there is a lot to be said for outstanding for space defense and they don't have a Napoli. Dutch are to -- Dennis and Callahan today they asked about -- commitment to improving his defense -- first race. Well he's very he's different pitches so working hard -- their prime -- -- still that'll yards of course this year or about this business in the hope he. -- and they were. A lot so -- the Fort Myers but. You know -- we may try to greater compliment and work with someone else do. -- or experiences that position -- we'll see that is something we're trying to figure out spring training. You know obviously you know what would like to have. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- And their response it'll end earlier offense. Where are the workflow and you know there are well so you know look what apple does a lot of sense and we know that. In the early minutes you know you know that's the center. Is Doug Mientkiewicz still available could be offices of -- while over this is the yeah so anyway what do things when you look at that Napoli when you go to spring training. -- touched on one of them earlier today which was. His ability to it to judge how far he has to go over to second base you remember Kevin you this when he went to first base. This was one of the huge problems he had he would range to way over your way out of position and and find himself in a bad spot. That and also just his hands because. You hear a lot of these guys who go from one position to first base and typically even -- Victor Martinez who came up as a shortstop. And they have really good hands Michael had really really good hands amazing so so you want a seat does this guy does this catcher. Have good hands and they think he does but you know I think it's a see and believe type situation. As a -- a situation -- Napoli where now they notice now he's not heavy investment. Is it gonna be the kind of thing where it is a -- much as you might anticipated initial him -- a -- 150 games under twenty games the other guys in the coming to -- -- in the back up play forty games. I I think that you they're certainly going to have to plan on measuring his playing time both because his career track record suggests -- much I think that he's only played. More than a hundred I think that he's basically plateaued at about a 120 games. Throughout his career in part because he's potentially yeah but also because. You know view you don't wanna grind him down to bits -- for when you have deteriorating bone. It's eventually going to die but is it trusting because the dynamic you certainly changed because of the contract in that respect. You look at. If you said hey Mike -- police claim against these type of pitchers -- he's playing under intense games he say well okay he makes five million dollars a year. If he was locked into that three years 39 million people we scream -- first year of the contract how -- not played this as an -- -- -- yankees after I came back and stuff I think now people would be -- with the situation yeah and for it's been a while now that the Red Sox have anticipated that they would need more than just a guy on the bench who can play first. They need to have an alternative. Who would be viable as an everyday player if needed for a couple three weeks at a time if he ends up on the DO. 6177797937. As the number texted 37937. All three of us I believe I -- -- as I have. -- you finish the Franco the book -- cliff notes all three of us have read the Francona -- or -- -- two books that's true I read I read analyst. Injury. I read most of what you were all part of -- Parts -- read Doherty an answer to get your reaction we talk about aggression different opinions on the book I get calls we talked with -- Francona to -- -- -- get back. I don't think so I think the real -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- wouldn't have written a script the way to end it I wouldn't -- that would probably partially. That definitely not good owners to actually think a really good owners. Oil like I just again I was disappointed. In some of the things so my communication with them I was very disappointed that doesn't mean they're not good people -- at all. Probably not I mean I'd I'd John. Stopping answered my emails and stuff like a long time at all. -- I would say probably not what you know again I'm not really sure why that happened but. It did so move on. -- Indians manager. And having very soon to be bestselling author Terry Francona. Oh but I guess he would you rate is Shaughnessy -- -- -- -- -- via both of the pitch in the back on the big show yesterday talking about that Alex. -- wrote about it I thought very well yesterday yesterday. -- -- -- -- days ago and now we've been we've -- I'd say what do you mean to a well representative do you mean you feel that leaves the reader writers dinner tonight. That true Francona and Mike -- truth while there not to mention affected John Ferrell is of course yes on time Indians this story. I read the book. -- most of the book I think you know. What Francona saying it's strange if we're talking McGregor in the break in in in Michael and is a sense of Francona is kind of backtracking. From what he wrote in the book -- If you read the book and ice I would suggest he should read it's good for sports book is good. It's funny though the real juicy stuff I feel the stuff it's kind of headline stuff. What is much comes from the deal as those from Francona and I had no anticipation of that coming in reading the book I didn't know that deal was gonna be that large care. I've I agree entirely I think that he has voice is very strong and when the accusations are made it quote unquote the monster and what it did. Kind of mess and ratings guiding. By the Red Sox towards this so called cliff that you know there was Adrian Gonzales. In Carl Crawford that is all from -- the only stuff that it Francona is critical of the owners make no mistake I hated -- hates the team. It's -- critical there of the personalities of all of them talks about John Henry is this aloof guy who left him waiting. An hour per ten minute interview -- Francona assumes Henry were taken it was terrible. And in fact Henry was time people but it was a great -- to a Democrat. But does so he he from a personality standpoint. They -- Perfectly harmonious. In Franklin is also critical affected marketing was getting in the way of being a good baseball team when it came to things like trips to Japan. And exhibition season trips to Arizona that were unnecessary in left the team out of whack. But it's Figo was critical of the owners essentially when it comes to the matter personal -- presented as. That's as much on me is anyone I failed to manage the monster but those early action right right but clearly he's talking about an organizational culture. It was created ends. You know and led to bad personnel decisions. I feel like rob when you read it sort of the stereotype it's out there about each one of those three owners. These kind of what you get. You get sort of you know -- that was an evil guy. He's angry you know it's always quick to go after Francona didn't Henry is kind of a nice guy believe -- -- he's kind of aloof he's sort of Spacey. The floats in and out of the ball QB email on the go out. And -- a guy who is trying every week change in his way into the mix was sort of obsessed with NASA and at what Francona says. Is sort of an -- has been -- of these guys -- over the last 345 years. Yeah I think there when he's talking -- -- the emotions still raw I mean probably even more -- they are now. You go back to this this season we go back the hundredth anniversary thing which he wasn't the comeback for. He talks about in the book. By even after that it's they owe me something mail me something and then in the week he we'd never found out really boy what they Odom. By he there's a lot of bidders studios -- comes out in the book clearly by. I think that. Other than that other than Francona kind of taking his jabs at the owners the more powerful stuff port that is exactly what you said that -- stuff. And what but what makes the book entertaining if Francona and the anecdotes and really that's the way it is that that's how -- is he likes tell those stories and AL involve his bathroom he yes but it was you know but that's what it. Got it helps the book move along it's just not this angry rant to the owners. As you guys said he almost -- -- due to a certain to -- No he doesn't I didn't realize you know I heard stuff people would never tired of -- Francona relation may not have been as strong as was. Presented in that book you know it seems like there's a pretty united front here. In that all of this is -- chance he goes out. Is still looking at is look at this my one chance to get shots in the owners and I can hide behind Frankel whose name Franco's title and say everything I wanna say about this ownership. Put it this way I don't anticipate that Theo Epstein is going to be writing a book anytime soon and you know certainly. He has he's had a message that he's been articulating. About the Red Sox organization. Starting with this June when you know when he was in Chicago in the Red Sox were getting ready to come to town. I sat down with him Johnson -- sat down with him from Boston Herald he talked to this station on the air and started talking about the monster and you know in this idea that there was a perversion of the principles -- a successful. In healthy franchise for the long term there was too much of a focus on the short term in here that's unmatched further when you have things like that mess in. I've -- -- and ratings meetings and the marketing guy who says you need more of sexy Pedroia. -- -- It is beyond us and we've said this before Francona. The manager of the team doesn't really matter if they spend money what the motivation is to spend money. The motivation was all ought to whack we understand that but as the managerial and -- day -- -- tweak me a month to month. For Theo made it matters a whole lot more and that's almost the more important conversation between. The show in the ownership what ES stick with Francona I think it's just okay you know I'm gonna hit him with some jabs because her relationship with fractured this my chance to do. 6177797937. -- your phone number I look at that we talked about little bit last week. If I'm John Henry. And I see this book. Pissed off. I mean I gave you you know basically plucked you out of obscurity. To some degree. Did you. One of the troop plum jobs in baseball the 2003 -- that's why are -- power to ask you out of three. The 2003 team won 95 games right shouldn't be the World Series were not for whatever you know I agree though. Mystic Francona says he might have done the same thing -- he says that and a number of managers have -- it right they add a really good closer. Add the best big game pitcher a bit of his generation. Still you know a really good pitcher for our zone and shelling. I mean managers are gonna do a good job of that. I mean it's very insofar as Grady Little almost had a previous year's team in the -- their -- -- the same player Democrats won the World Series and he was really good at managing and pleasing a lot of different because it's Francies for a number of any thoughts but I mean. Let's be honest John Henry does give that job. You know those returns but this let's put this in perspective though and you're talking all the things you're saying legitimate that he should be grateful for John Henry. But give the opportunity all the is that some -- -- -- hope you get to 2011 you're talking about an eight the eight year span. And in any business this is how worked up you can you can I'm sure most of -- -- perspective let's say from -- prospective saint Henry's perspective sixteen months later after October 2011 in this book comes out. I can see why you deal pissed off. No that's but that's my point is that it's -- step back and say this guy should be appreciative that I should be appreciative. But the fact is eight years later in relationships. Hip bumps and road are fractured for. Various reason and in this case it was fractured because at the end of the day with -- 2000 all of. But that -- booted missing is that he then wrote a book about it. You know spill the secrets in his going out and promoting it and making money that's a little different and still be upset now -- profit. Yeah but -- this level how much -- upset. -- -- 878 when when when you get riled up about something you're gonna hate someone in even though they help you out down the line 88 years before seven years before six years before. You get to that point and they feel a you know what you really ruin my life. It's not like -- its proportionate in terms of how he's gonna rip. You got to take every avenue he's got to -- -- be offered their thoughts one is that kind of fascinating that John Henry declines to be interviewed for the book of all of the principles of all Francona bosses. He was the only one who was. Whose voice. Is not in the book now which -- and I'd notified by way I noise has not been in anything since the season. -- know if that's if that's more respectable or if it's less so because it's interesting that you know -- a lot of people are trying to preserve their legacies. Or at least you know their their record of accomplishment. Or at least try to balance that with this book he says agreed to stays out well it was my credit which by the way isn't typically is demo. You know he he's typically very reactionary to a whole lot of things right well yeah -- everything from. You know Wednesday knocking his wife -- or the mini -- for whatever. I think you could say the way this team is being put together this offseason good or bad everything opened its would be very good team bought. You could say that this is not a team is driven by Agnes. It's not sexy no I mean that it -- -- learned their lesson and maybe listen it's maybe tickets for a couple years but they are clearly. I think I've learned from their mistakes at least soulful. Why -- Josh Hamilton was yeah he's the -- dad absolutely and you say OK you know what he comes to us at three years rate and because they caught that that day that Josh Hamilton signed. Now they caught some heat in Dallas Dallas predicted didn't and understandable. But I think that was kind of what everybody you know -- both in the an -- organizational waiting for how would the owners react to the Josh -- situation. Back to the Francona the real fast is that you know I agree Alex I actually you can -- credit he stayed away. Every chance here in the book and it seems like that's sort of the -- the book. Is you know -- or Francona or somebody. -- on the three guys and then child she talks that he responds and you wait and pages it happens again over over you try to talk to Henry. Every decline I give credit he. I look at this guy from Henry I say -- yet we do a good job at the end -- -- stuff we -- a bad -- -- -- this -- tens of millions of dollars. Every -- clear to my knowledge. I -- a great opportunity. He won two world yours first rate. We gave him every financial every play every one we gave them for eight years. And I write this book which is basically what it's whether it's negative or not we certainly promoted. As being anti ownership. Well certainly that excerpt was was made -- -- that was front and if you're -- -- just I think sure I in that wouldn't be surprised by that I did find it so I do -- -- -- Francona described how. Thinks the Red Sox -- not -- For seven years in five months of the greatest in the hardest job that he could ever imagine obviously. The one thing that's fascinating about the book is that. The that one month. That he's it's kind of -- -- bracketed. Ends up having -- -- casting a shadow over the rest of it. And really you know obviously colors the tone because that's the most recent one month that he's talking about -- but he didn't intend for it to overshadow the Everest the other seven years and five months. Even though all of us like. Our everyone has been waiting by the when you open that book when they get the book they are open are open it drags out establishing for 2004 -- delicate for 2000 -- I great stuff I know -- and that's the thing rob right. Out of the things when I picked up the book I did the same thing. Is that not okay you know I wanna get to juicy stuff to get which you get into it -- a good job Francona -- in the Red Sox stuff. The baseball like for -- -- that's actually pretty much better follows. Agree totally six was 77797937. And number I see Mike Matt get to the rest the culture after break on the hot stove show W media. Just wanna I wanna -- before. I think I don't -- That was Terry Francona caught off camera not aware talking to John Ferrell and pretty explosive these are used -- By asking every camera Bavaria where all -- trolley. Like on the full account blog you can see the video -- they get over their WB -- dot com full count blog take a look at that spiral gets it now -- written to say there at the beginning let's get to the phone calls here Mike and are down. What's up -- already have Mike what's up. Good but my point eight. That recall has every right to do this and I do feel bad and ignoble attempt but his administration. Will bring -- under the bus when he left. Francona probably want to get another coaching job. Which is pretty difficult to do. What -- and a -- pop couldn't build any -- drug addict well I don't play and record that he's done in the pilot the business that I worked -- for eight years. And then when I went out the door it made it possible to begin next job everything's pregame. Mike let me ask you this though I mean break a jury the vote -- now. -- able Francona details in the book a pretty serious. Usage of pills or at least -- stored up. And I understand the sedate a bad job of -- but I also ask this do you know. Who -- leaks or Ted -- that story. Although I'm not into it and I'm seeing it -- administration -- be who was who suddenly look you know. -- get it that you had to get a -- recordable ridiculous. I think is a million guys Mike I really do mean that that's part of the probably get into that. Guys into the -- In the QL I think gives a decent listen. All things people -- about the Cuba this. But the Q -- a pretty fair answer. You can line up every single person in the organization and ask them and it and it is gonna -- if we get the -- person. I think -- also what we're forgetting here is obviously he obviously had problems with the ownership levels throughout his tanyon. And it came to a head when he was Politico party quit or whatever. But I think where the ownership where he has -- legitimate beef with the ownership in my opinion is limited pick up his option August. I Barbara for the season yeah yeah I -- -- his contract in the in the past you know they signed him to his extension when he had. More than a year yet that it used at the end though obviously MER a but but that's that's bizarre thing if you go into that season. Lisa Terry Francona is not going to be the manager after CC it's crazy it noted that everything that. But you get to August and it's my opinion that if you do that with Francona. If you pick up his option. Then -- that doesn't happen they win at least a couple more games there in the playoffs because he beat you with consumed. But he said it himself while a pre debate was on here at the was on the big show which is. Hey you know what right we are committed agreement not to talk about my option but believe me I mean he was consumed by I don't think that again I don't know if Jon Lester pitches that September mr. frank and I just I think I think nobody -- -- -- the one thing that -- the one interesting part though is that Beckett. Tuned him out whereas in past years you've been responsive where he had had the kind of meet your tock of aide Josh in -- leader of the pitching staff and you know there were at these notions that. Beckett went off Orioles in terms of his conditioning that Lester kind of followed him down the dark pat. Down the down at the restaurant applies to you about -- I don't there's no proof that this will work but you look that same year I think -- went to his option picked up. It it is something that helps. Well I guess sorry I didn't have jumped into -- just finished out of season when he didn't have any sector job security beyond it got to the world I think you go and without the -- -- historical and after everything I asked it to their guys get their options picked up billions instincts are absolutely it's right to know -- slowly but you're talking about what you think -- good for the team for that team at that moment. I would say hey you know what that would be something to help but it didn't matter. Because I think at the end of the day exactly what you said before well I think I think -- -- the whole thing through them to triple the shore but I -- acknowledge is that in the book I just a real danger was right the only so that is so that maybe that leads to exactly why didn't pick up the option that they want to get credible one way everything's changed during the year they start looking at the sentencing was a problem maybe but then you have to ask the question is. If they do make the playoffs obviously they make the playoffs the whole story isn't it. I don't think. And if they make the playoffs this -- of the the come up to Francona return for the other area with them understanding everything is going on to Tibetans in Ontario wants to talk about the Red Sox camera the season's -- -- that. They get -- is built around their love your show. And I agree without letting that Red Sox -- really go on under the radar I think. Last year I'm not trying to blame everything on Bobby Valentine but he was so -- that that he. And -- that have been in there with a negative net I think it as like that like the flexibility of the team that they have three switch hitters they have the power they have -- He stepped than they have in the ball and then I think rotation will be better I think they're rather than people think I expect ninety plus win. I think there outside his considerable but you know I think that the baseline for expectations. Until they've proven that they can be a winning team the burden of proof is -- against them. I do think that they have more potential talent assembled the most people give them credit for. But at the same time you know how that translates as an open question although you know again -- can go up and down every contender the American League east and find. -- their health concerns lover -- I don't remember team like this where you couldn't make a case so far to one side or the other side they're going to be good are they gonna be bad the problem is is that it's a lot easier to make the case why is not gonna work out. Because of all the things we -- the beginning the show all the things that could fall through doll off pat takes his. 234 things and hope you'll have the people to fill in those gas. 6177797937. Is number 6177797937. You can text us -- 37937. You can tweet us at Brad foe at Alex -- mr. And at -- men and you'll respond to those and -- your phone calls we get back putts so show we're here till. 730 celtics' pregame big game tonight here vs knicks of the Sox getting -- -- -- three games coming up. -- acts of the call for you here on WEEI. Yesterday making a page -- signing is it just bringing any guy. A ceremonial guy -- -- spring training can sign choked away science and stuff forces say. In actual you know baseball move by its. I'd say a little of both this is -- this is obviously he has cash Davis as a sexy name this is the sexiest name of the off season. To be added by the Boston Red Sox at the same time. His impact could be considerable because I would say that I've never seen a guy who's so good at breaking down. Precisely the pitching or hitting mechanics of the game as Pedro Martinez -- game is unfolding that's why that's one of the reasons why it was such an unbelievable pitcher. People always talk about how he could see things in a hitter the know what else could see immediately. And so that's good to be helpful in terms of kind of in terms of kind of helping to educate. Some had to go to the Major League level below and he's a great recruiting -- right in the Dominican from the sixteen year old kids are trying to decide between two organizations. Paid work with Pedro that's pretty good selling point he had -- -- del Rosa when he was talking and he he took great amount of pride not only worked and paid nobody's brother Ramon by. You know I think that this is what Pedro was going to be and they asked him and big so what -- you wanna do -- line. Easy as he said -- think you want to spend the time that -- gonna take to be a coach or manager front office guy. He didn't learn about it but what he's gonna learn as it those guys have long long hours is probably not so these gonna do exactly guys right bosses. Here for. -- -- already been putting him you know a me an 8 AM to 2 AM today at the office right. Value that's an amazing it is a patient -- Schweigert it was more than -- is a different dancing -- I guess I think certainly thinks so I do it because I think that Varitek is more interested. In experiencing. More of the game more of the nuts and bolts that of the front office side of it as well I agree I agree in the sense that Varitek all the things they said the Pedro is not going to be. I could -- Varitek being. And I think I don't know if you want to ride the buses but I can see him being a coach I could see him being a manager could see him. Actually even being in the front office where again Pedro lights to do what he wants to do which is fine. But it does not say hey you know while also is going to be pitching coach if he's not. 6177797937. As the phone number to get back to the calls Allison is in Cambridge she. Good evening it's part of a program that good feeling that the -- -- kind of surprised a lot of people but -- -- -- lot of problems that happens the -- It happens to present him with an -- person. At one of the times. -- -- local and nationally that absolutely and we have a company that came after the trade deadline there's no ending that it was incredible deliberately has got. The next president of the great confidence and other. I was very shocked when particularly the -- equipment reported that there are people in the front office the coalition lead person. And that that is what led to a lot of personnel decisions and also without without that would let this particular -- and definitely has -- Else I would ask this though you know you talk with 2010. I always wonder this because they were five million games over 500. In August of 2011 did suddenly one day everybody woke up and said you know. -- injuries of 2000 tender now. I think that led to the personnel decisions in the community -- -- very good chemistry. But unlike other than perhaps I haven't picked up the -- so what's the context and. The option yeah Robert RO RI and -- I do think that you know we talked about this and with a Francona thinks about what the motivation was for them opening up the piggy bank. It heading into 2011 I'll examine doubt. That it was the sexy was an estimate we understand that but who cares. -- you basically went from we can't afford guys to hear you can go sign guys it's just a matter of picking the right guy. Let's put pets you know I understand they had that meeting they had to spend 400000 dollars and all that they said they wanted -- colors and -- says the event it at some extent. But it's a sign to some random guy disease sexy traders. No but Carl Crawford -- and the clintons causes and sighed heavily it's relevant dollar now but the Carl Crawford thing it means is. You went from -- counting your Nickels and dimes -- -- the Adrian Beltre and sighed resigning -- Marti is an. Everything else. To a certain extent to dramatically overpaying for Carl Crawford out of nowhere and I don't know when that decision was made maybe it was -- -- early on the Nazis. One of the interesting things in the book is that Francona describes the recruiting trips that -- made consecutively. To both Carl Crawford in Jason -- -- point in the world it's it's kind of amazing because they make this series in concerted sales pitch to Crawford. In Houston. And then they go they meet up with worth -- because a lot of talent on the go ahead. Thanks rob I appreciate your deference they've never gives up Martha audio book to us and Jayson Werth in the Chicago O'Hare airport. -- apparently Theo and Tito both got pretty drunk before -- that's because they knew that they are going to extend part of it was a great time yeah worth worth wrote them later and said yeah. But the beer thing now in the chicken stuff which I think is over rated. But it's funny you know you'd think about the drinking culture of the game there's a lot of stories or Franco a drink with the too I mean these guys kinda the joke drinking every night in the middle of the 2004 postseason which we've heard before -- -- that it's just seems that it's big part of that culture. I am a holidays and that's why that -- decide above no drinking in the clubhouse and we understand you don't wanna drink and drive when your home and everything else. By even. I think the motivation behind that was more PR than the concern that -- gonna get an accident going holiday this silly that you look when you step by that okay there was still a still it's silly these guys during the year clubhouse after that is cowardice it's well it's -- -- -- get rid of it it's silly it's silly that these guys go -- have to have tobacco in their -- every time -- to the plate right now it's it's but that's. You know it is what culture is what I mean if John Henry said tomorrow -- -- tomorrow there's going to be -- and drinking club posts there would be no drinking club that's what happened by aspirin right you just could you could just -- -- Well they did it. Not out of -- what does that really matter at this hour for Francona wasn't it just didn't matter enough to prohibit it right because it was a part of the culture but he is -- that's that's -- point it doesn't matter it doesn't matter one way -- the other I don't think. And that's why you're going along you won using these rules in this environment and everything else before. The motivation behind doing that was PR -- oil because -- sit quite right this is affecting the play on the field yet now. Now that's a thing again we're doing it in August there are way or 500 is doing -- winning championships right. It's a PR move public of the fact that you think Paul Warner is Red Sox organization what kind of -- -- I actually think -- it depends on the player they all have voices at the table. But the book -- it makes very clear that John Henry is the ultimate voice I'm not from from the ownership perspective. On all of these issues in so I do think that Warner gets to Werner is involved in all of these discussions he can influence film. But I don't think that he has final say ultimately -- You know for instance I'm sure that he was involved in in consulting about you know how far do we go with that John Lackey. You know how far we go with a Carl -- Well you get the sense you get the census John Henry leans on Tom war right. And that they think John Henry also made this like any business deep deep guy at the top is gonna make the ultimate decision. But he go back to them off season leading into 2011. Remember being at the GM meetings I think it was. When Warner went on this radio station and said. Hey you know what we're gonna make what he sailor and make two significant moves. And at that point keep going what he talked about everyone to know and soul. -- he he was -- he was he was in this kind of group that was saying hey you know what this open up the -- back. But it's just a bad time this book the way people feel about this ownership right now and listen -- a good year this year bigger deal last year the spoke with -- -- and that's I mean that's history -- If they're good next year it won't matter as much but the way people feel but this group right now fair or unfair it's just -- was feeling -- -- In the excerpt first came out it was I think if you said who knew what side you're on every I think though. Vast majority would be on the side of -- for -- It's still hard -- -- that that hasn't changed at all I think way more people than not. West avoid ever ever think everything the Red Sox it does right now is met with skepticism. Which is I'm like it is really interesting to think about how far it's come because I remember sitting on the field in the dugout with the general manager of another team. May be like 34 years ago. And he was just from his perspective singing the praises of the Red Sox -- Is talking about how when he wants to get money to sign guys for over slot bonuses in the draft he asked to beg and plead and try to explain with his ownership group. He pointed to the Red Sox ownership box and he was in -- that these guys understand the -- Theo doesn't have to explain any of that -- He they just say how much do you need and they put the money forward. And you know there's a lot that this ownership group does understand about baseball. In is actually done very well about baseball including to my mind deferential behavior when it comes to guys like Carl Crawford. Even when you know John Henry said it and I decide reservations of. -- and -- still -- data and that's the things a little disingenuous in terms of the all this criticism is because. You allowed to get the money signed the right guys that we understand it's not he is not a slam dunk no matter what you do but yet take ownership readings on the right guys. But -- -- I think that we hear all these ad campaigns come out with a Red Sox now you study here and trickle out more and more. In a very self deprecating there like you don't we understand that we have to win back your trust a little there was a little bit of that last year. By. They hit it really going over board with it out. None of that matters none of it matters what all that matters is if they win in April. Good as they went in April this it's still -- that as the law is as little Maloney says it's still going to be the longest month in the history month 2000 allow. And took -- -- -- -- of the upstart and now I'm still at the same Kennedy didn't like might suggest to bring sexy back it was worth 6177797937. A short break we're back and hot stove show W yet. -- are coming in here at 379378. You know it just doesn't matter he they can -- always advertise that they want it and the guy with the weird voice talking about these. Pretty veterans they can talk about. 162 chances the fans right now until they start winning games and not -- -- league east Texas sort of you know. The last three matters. Because this guy is the good guys being Francona got the shaft the entire human cases sympathy for that the one above a tall order should have no say -- -- market. There are from the team Tom this ownership in you know basically go F themselves. Blue jays fans to -- on the team. And I'm with you stink. That last six all of the ownership sucks Pedro Martinez back million people. Right now for. You know you grow up around. And you say to somebody you know this group is in the coming in -- -- championships. And in three years later fours later you're going to eat them it's hard to believe that it talks the people and he Tim Thomas right now that's how it. Is today but as you said before they win that's the only way you can turn this whole thing around. It is not quick start though that's different than last -- quick start I think you could be good this year in -- if they're sixteen yeah I think I I think fit in April if they win this still going to be some skepticism that helps their cause certainly. By Ian it was me collapsed -- had the most historic collapse ever so people are going to be -- 6090 -- -- and and really even last year. You your kind and it and then you collapse -- -- -- is wholly different circuits and one half game out at the trade deadline of the wild. And that some -- it and we go back to know how what was perceived how this team was perceived last year at this time. Emotions were still raw from the from September but there was a little bit of people being blinded I think by the whole Bobby down time. Prancing around everywhere in the offseason there was skepticism to -- yet but some -- whether or kind of distracted -- -- they felt like other still did very little. Are still seemed like it was such a force so we didn't think Buchholz and Lester we're going to be like that -- Nader and Gonzales is -- turn into a singles hitter who ever walked or -- very immediate pressure etc. etc. so we talked about Napoli to start the show and it's not an overwhelming I think by any measure. Classic free agents that they brought -- to be fair -- mean neighbors breasts -- guys that some people like some people don't. When you look at these guys though I guess -- or anybody who jumps out as being born arresting somebody else to be maybe is sort of -- big daddy you're looking ahead of the group that came in the. Yeah I think that there's a large emphasis on the -- -- -- they didn't bring in stark -- guys but I do think that they brought in one who has that potential in Stephen Drew. And he's really interesting because Washington Nationals general manager. Mike Rizzo was with the Red Sox is the scout and he started he he contributed to this got a good Nomar Garciaparra when he was in college up for the Red Sox. And that he was the guy who scouted and drafted Stephen Drew he talked about those two guys. Likely curable. Oh lead it to be here are outstanding at different to shortstop with -- range. Or work. And -- strength. A light. They have this is this -- it was a that -- ever eager to move believed in me and -- routinely. I know what are not my head. I picked. More quick -- First step quickness and these people are much the most smoother. There are -- at shortstop. -- had just kept. He followed that they're really came to resolve when -- where Steve and abducted -- look at it flew it looked at actual there. It could produce a lot of doubles Lou a lot of triple -- -- surprise surprisingly -- helped direct -- for it Apollo. What what is healthy so. I think it well although they're different skill. Eight people canceled out to the -- -- -- I'm Major League here that are contributors and -- -- normal and Albert illustrious career long term career in -- Qwikster is to reflect or offer a picture shift to a part of -- -- career. You know we talked of a -- with the beginning in sort of how can go one way or the other way with him Doris clearly won those guys too we can -- 35 games in the hurt. We're giving yearly to give -- three years ago where he's you know one of the better shortstop based. Anderson was talking about that he said that he really side in 2010 a guy who is kind of having our just a tremendous season and seemed like he was coming into his own. As -- the better short stops -- game he's an upside guy you know he has a chance to beat you know maybe not as good as Adrian Beltre because you know. Adrian Beltre honestly played himself in a hall of fame consideration rise to a different level player bush no more mean. That's doubts that a fair that compares and you more in terms of no probably not in terms not in terms of overall value what Nomar became but. He saw a similar a player who had. Eight who had similar overall talent in the aggregate as an amateur. In so he might not hit the same plateau that Nomar did. If the peak of his career but. He's pretty damn good relative to what the field isn't so when you talk about things that need to go right for the Red Sox and can go right through his -- queasy in you know I wrote about this today drew is one of five guys who are gonna become free agents are eligible become free agents. After the year. And obviously -- this call flying off for error that we're in now it becomes interesting -- -- drew those two guys represented by Boris. And you keep feel pretty safe about giving him a qualifying offer if they have any kind a year because Boris is document take that puts the judge on our friend here before we have to -- -- to the Celtics a job. Gay -- protected. -- all I -- if you told me and out at a steady build -- they want. I'd -- game. -- I I can bet yes not probably if you told me that if England win. Eight or 85 games. Bet that they need help be that they came out of the gate and they established themselves again and guys who. Play the game the right way. Start right -- right. We know that you're could it seemed like equipped early and they never got out of the box -- and and so they would just do that. And expectations pretty well. I feel like that would be. A building block for next. Get an expert I think I underwriting expertise rob Arnott you know like they were two years obviously a Big -- he would be in the minority. Because I I think that people still wanna win did 86 and 76 season he missed the collapse of the play hard. The of people like this team that are really real quick are made in the feel over the baseball writers' dinner said Francona and Lucchino on opposite sides of the room. At the cocktail hour -- did not interact at all. Uga wants him that is there any chance later on the rights and drinks will be fight that's why don't that's like going oh yeah restaurants don't -- all right guys you appreciate that rob -- -- next week and I we couldn't wait now Celtics knicks big game -- Macs have before you got you -- Speaking of fights you never know there up next -- up next.